45: Pete Woods, MC + Commentator
Pete is a commentator and MC who has commentated for several world cups and North American elite competitions. In this episode, we’ll learn about the art of MCing, times he’s gotten flamed online as a commentator, and we get a lot of insight into the financials of broadcast and climbing as a sport, including the best argument I’ve heard yet for why Eurosport is a good deal. It’s clear to me in this episode that Pete is a huge proponent of growing the climbing community and his passion really shines through!
Timestamps
Timestamps of discussion topics
0:00 - Intro
1:30 - Mad Rock Shoutout!!
2:13 - Climbing in 1 World Cup
8:15 - Deciding not to be a dirtbag climber
11:13 - The art of MCing
15:13 - Is MCing or commentary more fun?
18:58 - The price of broadcasting
21:06 - Getting yelled at for commentary
27:03 - SLC world cup v6 boulders
37:41 - How to trick top climbers with holds
39:43 - The value of non-IFSC comps
46:26 - Cost of putting together Dockmasters
51:41 - Punk Rock Masters' crazy $50k cash purse
59:52 - Are climbers cheapskates?!
1:11:37 - IG Q: Are dynamic moves a good way to make climbing more mainstream?
1:16:26 - IG Q: What do you want to be remembered for?
1:17:51 - IG Q: What's your current relationship with CEC?
1:24:49 - IG Q: What's your golf handicap?
1:29:01 - Climbers need to be promoting climbers!
1:34:55 - Closing thoughts + where to find Pete
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WEBVTT
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Streaming events at the quality that people want
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is very expensive. Tens of thousands of dollars.
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And people in the tower, oh, the slab was too
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hard. And I talked to the chief and he was like,
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the slab was V6. People say that World Cup climbing
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in Europe is now behind a paywall. It's not.
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It's on TV. That was always the goal. People
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that consume sports. understand that part of
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consumption is economics. And I think climbing
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for so long has had this, it's owed to me that
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it's free. Welcome to another episode of the
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That's Not Real Climbing podcast. I'm your host,
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Jinni, and I'm excited to introduce my guest
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for today, Pete Woods. Pete is a commentator
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and MC. He's commentated for several World Cups
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and North American elite competitions. In this
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episode, we'll learn about the art of MCing,
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times he's gotten flamed online as a commentator,
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and we get a lot of insight into the financials
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of broadcast and climbing as a sport, including
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the best argument I've heard yet for why Eurosport
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is a good deal. It's clear to me in this episode
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that Pete is a huge proponent of growing the
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climbing community and his passion really shines.
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So I hope you enjoy this episode with Pete. I'm
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excited to announce that my sponsor, Mad Rock
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Climbing, just came out with a brand new pair
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of shoes, the Remora Pro. I was so excited to
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try them on that even though I broke a toe on
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my right foot, I had to at least try on the left
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shoe. So I can definitely say that the Remora
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Pro is better than a rental shoe. But really,
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these are their softest shoe ever, which means
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you no longer need to worry about standing on
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sketchy volumes and comps. They also have a crazy
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3D heel that allows you to get more surface area
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when heel hooking and inserts that lock your
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heel into the shoe no matter how hard you're
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pulling. Feel free to message me if you have
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any questions about the shoes or sizing and you
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can use the discount code NOTREALCLIMBER for
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10 % off your entire Mad Rock order. Back to
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the show. What have you been up to? It's been
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a while. I'm good. I've been busy. Like I have
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a day job, right? So like I have my regular job
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that I do. What is that? I'm the head of supply
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chain for a financial tech company. Whoa. Okay.
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I didn't know that. Yeah. So that's my, I mean,
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my job keeps me pretty busy. And then I was just
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in Mississauga for the Jackalope, which was awesome.
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Oh, that just happened. Oh, I totally missed
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it. How was that? You can't, yeah, you can't
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catch, there's no online, there's no streaming
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presence for Jackalope. You just have to be there.
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Oh, sad. Would it be better if it was streamed,
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do you think? Um, yeah, that's something we can
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definitely talk about. It's the, we tried it
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once, um, and it falls into the same problem.
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So it's super expensive. Um, and the Jackalope
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kind of the model, they like to do things kind
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of as high end as they can. So like in the skate
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side of things, it's mostly a skateboard. It
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initially was a skateboard competition. Um, but
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two years they've had Tony Hawk, uh, the Tony
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Hawk for demo team come through. They always
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have like top names in skateboarding that they
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bring in. Bob Burkess was there this year. So
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like they're super established and they decided,
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all right, we'll stream it and we'll stream kind
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of all the semis and all the finals. They brought
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in, you know, a couple of big names to do the
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skate broadcast and I did the climbing broadcast.
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And the only downside was that that was the one
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year we decided to make it an NACS event. So
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we took a festival comp and we decided to make
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it an NACS event, hoping, thinking we would bring
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in some of the highest top athletes. So now you're
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dealing with judges and rules and all these things.
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And we had like a correspondence sort of like
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on the mat. And the idea was like after people
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came off their finals boulder, you'd be like,
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hey man, how would that go? And all the final,
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all the climbers were into it. And the jury president
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for the comp was like, no. And we were like,
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this is the future of the sport. Like why like
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sideline reporting is a thing. Um, so it, that
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kind of fell a bit into like, it was just another
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broadcast and it poured with rain and it was
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wildly expensive and they haven't done it since.
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So yes, would it benefit from a stream? Sure.
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It'd be awesome. Even if you just put, you just
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let it run like with the, the kind of the vibe
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of the space. Cause it's, there's like a thousand
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people watching outside. So it's a hell of a
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comp. I think it would be great to stream it,
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but it's, really expensive. Okay. So we will
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get into the details of all of that and like
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the price of setting up events and streaming
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and stuff like that a bit later. But for, I think
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like a lot of the international crowd may not
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know who you are. So what is your climbing background
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and what do you do? My climbing background, I
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started climbing a little over 30 years ago.
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I grew up in Ontario in Canada and just had I
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stumbled across it. I had a friend who said,
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hey, we're going to go climbing this weekend.
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And I said, okay, sure. Rock climbing, great.
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And it was just hooked. It was one of those things
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that just caught me that something about it appealed
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to me. And I kind of went all in on climbing.
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I quit a bunch of other sports that I was doing.
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I was in university. And then I started competing.
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So basically in the first year I started climbing,
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I started competing and I started managing a
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climbing gym. Wow. So there was something about
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competition. I've been competing. Every sport
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I did, I did competitively. So for me, climbing
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and competition was a natural pair. And then
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the outside part of climbing was the recreational,
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like the enjoyment, the escape, the outdoors
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corner of it. And also a little bit of competition.
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So you're like, you're trying to send roots.
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You're trying to send all the problems. Like
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that's your focus. So I've had this anchor in
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competition since almost the first. you know
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it's easily within the first year it's like they're
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fuzzy memories now it's like i think it was the
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first year maybe it was the first 16 months something
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like that but i went to my first ever competition
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we drove from ottawa to montreal i came in dead
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last um and i was like that's the greatest thing
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ever uh and i never came last again you know
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that's one of those things so i competed um for
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quite a long time i competed um like in canadian
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nationals as soon as we started having canadian
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nationals i did quite well for a few years like
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when i was sort of in my climbing prime um I
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went to one World Cup when I was coaching the
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youth national team. So I started coaching when
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I moved out west and I loved coaching. So you
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went to a World Cup as a coach? I went to a World
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Cup. I went to Youth World Championships coaching
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our national youth team. And then we went to
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a World Cup in part of our European adventures.
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We stayed in for like almost six weeks and climbed
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all through Europe. And there was a World Cup.
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So myself and Mike Doyle. went and competed in
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that world cup and i came in like third last
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like i was not ready to climb in a world cup
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yeah it was that experience experience i had
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no idea you didn't even tell me that one those
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are i i still have the i have the tank top so
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i have the was in aprica in italy um i have the
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tank top from that event and essentially i applied
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i said we're going to be in europe there's a
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world cup at the same time i was climbing quite
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hard like i was like a good climber and I got
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approval from the National Federation, you know,
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and off we went and we entered this comp and
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it was, I mean, Steve McClure, like it was sort
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of 2002, I think was the year we were there.
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And it was, it was only, it was route comps and
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it was very intimidating. The city was basically
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closed. We were in like the hotel, like all the
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climbers in the same hotel. And you walked over
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to the venue, you just stand in front of this
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massive lead route. And you try and work it out.
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And then I was nervous and I got pumped. The
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route was like really, really technical at the
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bottom. So classic route setting would make you
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pumped like at the very beginning. And I just
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couldn't I couldn't outrun the pump by the time
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I was in the middle of the roof. And that was
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it. And I think I came like fourth last or something
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like I got rocked. I mean, you didn't even get
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last. So it was super fun. But I kept coaching.
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I love coaching almost right away. Um, and I'd
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coached a bit of other sports. So I, I kind of,
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I liked coaching in general, uh, and I liked
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coaching climbing. There's just something about
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sort of breaking down movement and, and working
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with individual athletes, like in that team space.
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I really liked the way that lent itself coaching
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teams where you, it's harder to have an impact.
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I think when you're coaching large teams, soccer
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team, volleyball teams, things like this. But
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you're coaching individual climbers in this group
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environment, in this sort of co -training environment.
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So I kept coaching as I kept competing. And then
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eventually you, like I wasn't training full -time.
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I had a job, right? I wasn't really a full -time
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climber. I tried to be for a little bit. I was
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repping a couple of climbing brands. I went through
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that art. I was sponsored. I had all this stuff.
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I was like, maybe this is the way. And then I
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was like, I kind of like want to. live in a nicer
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apartment and I, you know, want to have a car
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and I want to go on vacations. So I decided I
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got a job. I had a real job. And that chips away
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at your ability to go climbing. Right? Yes. Like,
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oh, you gotta, you know, you have to go kind
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of be part of society and not, people choose
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to do that and not do that. And some people choose
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to take climbing in like a full -time direction.
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And I just decided that wasn't quite for me.
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So I was content. I have, looking back, become
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content with making decisions, maybe kind of
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just at the tail end of the prime of my climbing
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where I was like, ah, if I had gone all in, you
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know, what would have happened? So I think we
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all have those moments. And in the moment, I
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was fine with it. And looking back, I'm fine
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with it, but I definitely kind of think, oh,
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could I have done something different with this
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sport? But I think if I had done something different
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to the sport, I might not be where I am now.
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And I love where I am now. I love having transitioned
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from competing to being given the opportunity
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to emcee an event, a local event, and then being
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given an opportunity to do commentary at a local
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event and realize that there's a passion for
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that. And then I have a good at it and then grow
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that passion and grow that talent. And this is
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where I end up now. So maybe I wouldn't be here.
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So I think every step that you take on the path
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has an impact. I'm not a kind of fate person.
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I'm not a kismet person. But I do think that
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the choices you make, I mean, they take you where
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you are and you can have regrets. But if you're
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happy where you are now, you don't need to have
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those regrets. You can have like, you know. fond
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memories and like, ah, like I have this sort
00:10:48.129 --> 00:10:50.269
of anchor memory where a bunch of friends had
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gone to Bishop. Um, and I didn't go, I don't
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either didn't have the vacation time, or I think
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I was going to go to font and made that decision
00:10:57.090 --> 00:10:59.809
instead. And, um, one of them became, it was
00:10:59.809 --> 00:11:01.470
the first Canadian ascent of the Mandela. It
00:11:01.470 --> 00:11:03.490
was like the third ascent of the Mandela. Right.
00:11:03.549 --> 00:11:05.029
And that's, we're climbing the same level. You're
00:11:05.029 --> 00:11:06.830
like, oh, could I have been, you know, the third
00:11:06.830 --> 00:11:08.309
ascent of the Mandela? Like, could I have a,
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like a little stamp in a history book? Maybe,
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but at this point in your life, does it matter?
00:11:13.350 --> 00:11:15.879
You know, probably not. no yeah i totally feel
00:11:15.879 --> 00:11:19.639
that um okay so for those who don't know the
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nuances um how is emceeing different from commentating
00:11:22.799 --> 00:11:25.519
oh my goodness it's such a good question it's
00:11:25.519 --> 00:11:29.759
they are branches of the same tree so you are
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you have a responsibility in the event and i'll
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go i was just talking with a bunch of people
00:11:34.860 --> 00:11:37.259
because i was in mississauga the jackalope the
00:11:37.259 --> 00:11:44.980
mc side of it is the you are responsible for
00:11:44.980 --> 00:11:51.139
keeping the crowd engaged to a level that the
00:11:51.139 --> 00:11:53.559
climbers get the response they deserve for the
00:11:53.559 --> 00:11:56.500
work they're putting in. So you tread along this
00:11:56.500 --> 00:11:58.779
line, at least I do. I tread along this line
00:11:58.779 --> 00:12:04.460
of being integral to the event without sort of
00:12:04.460 --> 00:12:06.840
taking away from any of the moments and only
00:12:06.840 --> 00:12:09.299
trying to build them up a little further. So
00:12:09.299 --> 00:12:12.110
a crowd of people is a... literally a living
00:12:12.110 --> 00:12:15.590
breathing thing and they react to each other
00:12:15.590 --> 00:12:19.309
but you can kind of nudge them so i try and get
00:12:19.309 --> 00:12:21.210
them on my side i try and get them to want to
00:12:21.210 --> 00:12:24.029
see you know what we're trying to accomplish
00:12:24.029 --> 00:12:27.129
and the value that sort of their response to
00:12:27.129 --> 00:12:29.649
hard effort is and you don't only have to cheer
00:12:29.649 --> 00:12:31.710
for people topping boulders you can cheer for
00:12:31.710 --> 00:12:35.289
effort you can cheer for camaraderie you can
00:12:35.289 --> 00:12:37.149
cheer for people being nice to each other like
00:12:37.149 --> 00:12:38.950
you have all these kind of places where you can
00:12:39.450 --> 00:12:41.470
Not just be distracted and look at your phone
00:12:41.470 --> 00:12:44.149
or talking to your neighbor. So my job is to
00:12:44.149 --> 00:12:46.789
remind people that there's really exciting things
00:12:46.789 --> 00:12:49.690
happening right up here on this big stage. And
00:12:49.690 --> 00:12:52.350
then just to try to boost the moment. And it's
00:12:52.350 --> 00:13:00.190
high energy. It's high impact. It's not a lot
00:13:00.190 --> 00:13:03.070
of nuance. You're not allowed to describe the
00:13:03.070 --> 00:13:05.049
boulders. You're not allowed to tell people anything
00:13:05.049 --> 00:13:08.549
other than... Maybe I've pushed it on a couple
00:13:08.549 --> 00:13:12.950
of events. I had a chief root setter ask me to
00:13:12.950 --> 00:13:15.289
push the line a little bit at the bouldering
00:13:15.289 --> 00:13:17.590
project series a few years ago. My friend Tonde
00:13:17.590 --> 00:13:20.269
had said, he's like, we want to nudge it a little
00:13:20.269 --> 00:13:22.029
bit. It's not a sanctioned comp. He's like, you
00:13:22.029 --> 00:13:25.710
can tell the crowd in the room a little bit about
00:13:25.710 --> 00:13:27.529
the boulder. So why is it hard? It's like, oh
00:13:27.529 --> 00:13:29.389
man, that foot is so slippery. They're having
00:13:29.389 --> 00:13:32.230
real trouble getting it. Let's see if, you know,
00:13:32.250 --> 00:13:35.120
Sean can do it. So they've seen the boulders,
00:13:35.139 --> 00:13:36.320
right? They preview the boulders. There's no
00:13:36.320 --> 00:13:40.480
surprises. But the trick to not give away like,
00:13:40.580 --> 00:13:42.080
oh my God, I can't believe he heel hooked to
00:13:42.080 --> 00:13:43.580
the person that hasn't seen the boulder yet.
00:13:44.720 --> 00:13:46.480
That's where you draw that line. So trying to
00:13:46.480 --> 00:13:48.879
push it a little bit in terms of keeping people
00:13:48.879 --> 00:13:52.320
interested in what's going on. Are you allowed
00:13:52.320 --> 00:13:55.779
to say like if someone topped? I mean, I guess
00:13:55.779 --> 00:13:58.340
it's kind of obvious from crowd cheering anyway,
00:13:58.480 --> 00:14:02.889
but I don't know if you're allowed to. At sanctioned
00:14:02.889 --> 00:14:06.210
comps, it's way trickier. So I've had exchanges
00:14:06.210 --> 00:14:09.250
with chief judges and jury presidents over the
00:14:09.250 --> 00:14:13.009
years who were like, you can't. And I was like,
00:14:13.149 --> 00:14:16.730
they know. So you people, that's two hands. You
00:14:16.730 --> 00:14:22.289
have to connect. You're not in a vacuum. Beta,
00:14:22.450 --> 00:14:26.429
definitely not. But sort of information, yes.
00:14:26.509 --> 00:14:29.769
And you're right. It's almost impossible not
00:14:29.769 --> 00:14:33.009
to know. If someone has topped a boulder and
00:14:33.009 --> 00:14:36.230
even in whether you're doing festival style where
00:14:36.230 --> 00:14:38.509
you're changing the format or you're doing like
00:14:38.509 --> 00:14:42.269
a normal comp where people are sort of in ISO
00:14:42.269 --> 00:14:45.149
and then in secondary ISO together. If somebody
00:14:45.149 --> 00:14:47.470
comes back to secondary ISO a minute and a half
00:14:47.470 --> 00:14:50.850
after you, they flash a boulder and you'll have
00:14:50.850 --> 00:14:52.850
heard it from the crowd, especially at an event
00:14:52.850 --> 00:14:56.370
that has a lot of people at it. A thousand people
00:14:56.370 --> 00:14:59.870
are going to make. like a pretty big noise every
00:14:59.870 --> 00:15:02.690
time someone does a boulder. Or if someone gets
00:15:02.690 --> 00:15:06.149
to the zone and they haven't seen that yet, the
00:15:06.149 --> 00:15:09.610
kind of hum turns into like an explosion. And
00:15:09.610 --> 00:15:11.990
then if they keep going, it, you know, it manages
00:15:11.990 --> 00:15:14.309
to go even further. So you kind of, you always
00:15:14.309 --> 00:15:17.169
have an idea. Okay. So then going into commentary,
00:15:17.509 --> 00:15:19.669
well, I guess, do you have like a preference
00:15:19.669 --> 00:15:23.149
of doing one or the other? I, I waver. I waver
00:15:23.149 --> 00:15:26.990
when I'm in an event and I'm on the mats. in
00:15:26.990 --> 00:15:29.470
the middle of a final, there's a thousand people
00:15:29.470 --> 00:15:30.929
and the lights are on and people are topping
00:15:30.929 --> 00:15:35.350
boulders, I wouldn't trade it. It's so much fun.
00:15:36.009 --> 00:15:39.149
There's a kid that just snuck into finals in
00:15:39.149 --> 00:15:41.450
Mississauga at the Jackalope. He's a super good
00:15:41.450 --> 00:15:47.950
climber. On the last boulder, insane, crazy Gaston
00:15:47.950 --> 00:15:51.789
dino palm press thing. Stuck it. The roof comes
00:15:51.789 --> 00:15:56.269
off. He's all excited. He turns around and I
00:15:56.269 --> 00:15:59.700
was like, bro, he almost knocked me over. Like
00:15:59.700 --> 00:16:02.120
he ran up and like gave me this big bear hug.
00:16:02.200 --> 00:16:04.700
I almost fell over. Like it was so, so being
00:16:04.700 --> 00:16:07.419
connected to that level of energy and that emotion,
00:16:07.679 --> 00:16:11.419
it's wild. And I have these moments, you know,
00:16:11.419 --> 00:16:12.820
just standing around with people on the mats
00:16:12.820 --> 00:16:15.200
and at a comp where there's less, you know, we're
00:16:15.200 --> 00:16:17.220
not sanctioned so we can do what we want. You
00:16:17.220 --> 00:16:19.059
hang out with the athletes. I brought someone
00:16:19.059 --> 00:16:20.539
their chalk bags. She was hanging in an upside
00:16:20.539 --> 00:16:23.580
down knee bar. Like anybody, does anyone care?
00:16:23.700 --> 00:16:25.320
I looked at the other finalists. I'm like, can
00:16:25.320 --> 00:16:27.259
I? And they were like, So I brought her a chalk
00:16:27.259 --> 00:16:28.860
bag to chalk up in the middle of the climb. Like
00:16:28.860 --> 00:16:32.179
you don't, that's the connection for me is like,
00:16:32.200 --> 00:16:33.840
it's so much fun to be like, I'm just this little
00:16:33.840 --> 00:16:36.759
corner. I'm still involved. But broadcasting
00:16:36.759 --> 00:16:43.159
as a, at my kind of core in climbing as a coach,
00:16:43.179 --> 00:16:46.080
as a teacher, as a mentor, that's where broadcasting
00:16:46.080 --> 00:16:49.220
gets to shine because you have this platform
00:16:49.220 --> 00:16:55.519
of pretty engaged people who you can. Bring climbing
00:16:55.519 --> 00:16:59.139
to. You can teach the sport as it's happening.
00:16:59.259 --> 00:17:02.700
You can provide knowledge. You can give insight.
00:17:02.860 --> 00:17:07.680
You can talk about issues. I'm a huge, huge fan
00:17:07.680 --> 00:17:09.839
of root setting. I mean, I think we mostly are,
00:17:09.940 --> 00:17:11.759
but I'm a big kind of booster for root setting.
00:17:11.880 --> 00:17:14.279
A lot of my close friends are root setters and
00:17:14.279 --> 00:17:17.119
it's such a core component. And that's the thing
00:17:17.119 --> 00:17:18.599
that gets complained. People always go, oh, the
00:17:18.599 --> 00:17:19.819
root setting was this, root setting was that.
00:17:19.859 --> 00:17:22.880
So I'm a big defendant of root setting as an
00:17:22.880 --> 00:17:26.039
art. And you get to talk about it on a broadcast.
00:17:26.119 --> 00:17:28.319
You get to talk about the skill and the nuance.
00:17:28.380 --> 00:17:31.460
And I'll go and watch them tweak the final or
00:17:31.460 --> 00:17:34.440
tweak the semi and spend hours moving a foothold
00:17:34.440 --> 00:17:37.940
around. And for me to be able to say that to
00:17:37.940 --> 00:17:39.200
the people watching at home is like, what you
00:17:39.200 --> 00:17:41.079
don't know is that foothold used to be three
00:17:41.079 --> 00:17:43.039
inches to the right and the boulder was too hard.
00:17:43.500 --> 00:17:45.539
And now, you know, they tried everything and
00:17:45.539 --> 00:17:47.519
look now it's getting like it's being done a
00:17:47.519 --> 00:17:50.000
fourth or fifth or sixth try for people. So you
00:17:50.000 --> 00:17:52.920
get to have this. The same kind of conversation
00:17:52.920 --> 00:17:55.880
that you have out for dinner or around the coffee
00:17:55.880 --> 00:17:57.960
table, around the fire, where you break down
00:17:57.960 --> 00:18:00.940
climbing and you get into why you love it and
00:18:00.940 --> 00:18:03.720
you get into people's style and you get into
00:18:03.720 --> 00:18:05.920
why someone did a boulder and someone didn't.
00:18:06.019 --> 00:18:10.839
You get to get into watching teammates do something
00:18:10.839 --> 00:18:14.200
different on a boulder that is wrong that no
00:18:14.200 --> 00:18:15.799
one else did. You're like, oh my God, they obviously
00:18:15.799 --> 00:18:17.740
talked about that. So they're like, oh yeah,
00:18:17.759 --> 00:18:19.720
we're going to do this. And they both did it.
00:18:19.920 --> 00:18:21.420
And they both did it wrong before they had to
00:18:21.420 --> 00:18:23.099
come back around. And that gives you this window
00:18:23.099 --> 00:18:27.740
to talk about the way that route previews work.
00:18:27.940 --> 00:18:29.720
And you just have these threads you get to keep
00:18:29.720 --> 00:18:32.220
pulling on for a couple of hours. And you just
00:18:32.220 --> 00:18:35.140
get to hang out. And usually whoever the co -commentator
00:18:35.140 --> 00:18:37.779
is, is going to have a similar level of interest
00:18:37.779 --> 00:18:40.220
and passion about climbing. And there's places
00:18:40.220 --> 00:18:42.619
where you get to like, you know, sometimes you're
00:18:42.619 --> 00:18:44.700
just plain blown away or excited. And sometimes
00:18:44.700 --> 00:18:47.450
you're like. You get really, really nuanced about
00:18:47.450 --> 00:18:50.470
movement. And for me, that's super fun. So in
00:18:50.470 --> 00:18:52.250
the middle of a broadcast, if you ask me, I tell
00:18:52.250 --> 00:18:54.289
you every time I would do, if I had to pick one,
00:18:54.289 --> 00:18:55.970
I would pick broadcasting. In the middle of a
00:18:55.970 --> 00:18:58.569
final, when everything's going off, I'd be like,
00:18:58.650 --> 00:19:01.109
oh man, this is good times too. How much does
00:19:01.109 --> 00:19:03.529
it cost to stream a competition? And what all
00:19:03.529 --> 00:19:06.230
goes into that cost? Tens of thousands of dollars.
00:19:07.230 --> 00:19:10.609
Streaming events at the quality that people want
00:19:10.609 --> 00:19:15.000
is very expensive. World Cup level broadcast
00:19:15.000 --> 00:19:18.980
is the sports you're used to watching on TV.
00:19:19.059 --> 00:19:21.759
Those are the cameras. That's the production
00:19:21.759 --> 00:19:24.660
trailer. So, you know, I've shown people pictures
00:19:24.660 --> 00:19:27.740
from U .S. Nationals of the production trailer
00:19:27.740 --> 00:19:31.039
that's parked outside and the 50 monitors and
00:19:31.039 --> 00:19:33.460
like seven produce like people doing graphics,
00:19:33.599 --> 00:19:35.279
people doing all of these things. We have show
00:19:35.279 --> 00:19:38.640
run meetings like there's a team of at least
00:19:38.640 --> 00:19:41.519
10 on the production side plus camera people.
00:19:43.440 --> 00:19:47.279
Plus the commentary group team and all of those
00:19:47.279 --> 00:19:50.599
people have to get where you're going. So, you
00:19:50.599 --> 00:19:53.980
know, even just to fly, um, and, and a hotel,
00:19:54.059 --> 00:19:58.099
if to get me somewhere is going to be a couple
00:19:58.099 --> 00:20:01.579
thousand dollars times a second commentator,
00:20:01.599 --> 00:20:06.079
you're at probably five grand already just to
00:20:06.079 --> 00:20:09.519
have people in, in the building from wherever
00:20:09.519 --> 00:20:12.420
they live, you know, originally. And then you
00:20:12.420 --> 00:20:13.880
have to get, you have to pay the camera people,
00:20:13.940 --> 00:20:15.619
you pay the producers, like all of these things
00:20:15.619 --> 00:20:17.420
kind of ticking all the way down the line. Of
00:20:17.420 --> 00:20:18.819
course, there's volunteers at climbing events,
00:20:18.940 --> 00:20:25.200
but no one's volunteering from, you know, a camera
00:20:25.200 --> 00:20:30.859
production crew. So they're, I mean, $40 ,000,
00:20:30.859 --> 00:20:33.740
$50 ,000, $60 ,000. I know the dock masters,
00:20:34.099 --> 00:20:37.400
the guys that put that on, they do other sports
00:20:37.400 --> 00:20:39.579
like that camera crew, that production crew.
00:20:40.320 --> 00:20:42.980
Um, and they, you know, they're, it's a small
00:20:42.980 --> 00:20:44.339
country, so they don't have to, they're like,
00:20:44.400 --> 00:20:46.799
they live in the Netherlands and they just have
00:20:46.799 --> 00:20:48.640
to come further. You know, they just come out
00:20:48.640 --> 00:20:51.019
to the city, but they still have to stay in hotels
00:20:51.019 --> 00:20:53.299
and still have to drive their cars. Like even
00:20:53.299 --> 00:20:55.960
if everyone lives in the city that you're putting
00:20:55.960 --> 00:20:58.539
the event on in, it's still expensive to pay
00:20:58.539 --> 00:21:01.400
everybody for that time. Um, and you, I mean,
00:21:01.420 --> 00:21:02.640
you're not bought, you're not renting camera
00:21:02.640 --> 00:21:04.400
equipment at this point. You're working with
00:21:04.400 --> 00:21:07.180
production companies that own it, but they're
00:21:07.180 --> 00:21:10.150
wildly expensive. Um, one thing, just a side
00:21:10.150 --> 00:21:12.210
note, if you ever get into broadcasting, grow
00:21:12.210 --> 00:21:15.509
a thick skin and do not read the comments. I've
00:21:15.509 --> 00:21:17.390
read some horrible things about myself. Hey,
00:21:17.450 --> 00:21:21.230
I'm an idiot, right? All these things. Um, but
00:21:21.230 --> 00:21:23.430
we, someone put in the comments and it came back
00:21:23.430 --> 00:21:26.529
around and said, you can't call them girls. Okay.
00:21:27.369 --> 00:21:30.349
But my female co -commentator calls them girls
00:21:30.349 --> 00:21:33.349
because that's, it's okay for her to say that.
00:21:33.589 --> 00:21:36.890
Oh, the girls. Unlike the women, right? The female
00:21:36.890 --> 00:21:39.009
climbers, the ladies, the athletes. So you have
00:21:39.009 --> 00:21:42.369
to build these things that are okay in a social
00:21:42.369 --> 00:21:45.329
setting at the pub that are not okay on a national
00:21:45.329 --> 00:21:47.349
and international broadcast. Do you remember
00:21:47.349 --> 00:21:50.869
like any other things that stand out to you that
00:21:50.869 --> 00:21:53.829
you had to like learn to change during commentary?
00:21:54.269 --> 00:21:57.869
You can't really be a fan doing commentary because
00:21:57.869 --> 00:21:59.769
then it just sounds like you're a fan. So I had
00:21:59.769 --> 00:22:02.630
to learn to be a little bit more kind of toned
00:22:02.630 --> 00:22:05.470
down a little more level for sure. So choice
00:22:05.470 --> 00:22:08.950
of words, choice of language. I had to change
00:22:08.950 --> 00:22:12.190
for sure. Just sort of throw away expressions
00:22:12.190 --> 00:22:15.730
that you might use that have no real impact.
00:22:16.769 --> 00:22:19.009
You know, I kind of learned to narrow your language
00:22:19.009 --> 00:22:21.430
down and be more descriptive in a more concise
00:22:21.430 --> 00:22:24.089
way. I like to wander when I talk. I like to
00:22:24.089 --> 00:22:27.710
meander, tell a story. But you have to be able
00:22:27.710 --> 00:22:29.410
to tell the story and wrap it up before the next
00:22:29.410 --> 00:22:31.670
climber gets on the wall. So I had to learn to
00:22:31.670 --> 00:22:34.940
be super dialed in. Um, and I've, it's funny
00:22:34.940 --> 00:22:36.579
cause I've talked to a couple of other people
00:22:36.579 --> 00:22:38.700
that did a podcast a couple of years ago and
00:22:38.700 --> 00:22:40.299
we were talking about being more concise and
00:22:40.299 --> 00:22:42.259
he was like, you are not a concise person. I'm
00:22:42.259 --> 00:22:44.980
like, I know like even this, this sort of wandering
00:22:44.980 --> 00:22:46.579
conversation that I'm having with him now, I'm
00:22:46.579 --> 00:22:48.559
like, you know, we're just telling stories and
00:22:48.559 --> 00:22:51.000
getting off track and you cannot do that. You
00:22:51.000 --> 00:22:53.880
have to remember all of these details. And, um,
00:22:53.980 --> 00:22:55.880
I was already pretty good at pronouncing names.
00:22:56.000 --> 00:22:59.299
Um, maybe just how I grew up. I started reading
00:22:59.299 --> 00:23:01.700
super young. So like, I'm not. I don't get worried
00:23:01.700 --> 00:23:04.880
when I look at foreign names. But I will forget
00:23:04.880 --> 00:23:07.920
things. I'll be like, oh, are they from? Oh,
00:23:07.940 --> 00:23:09.480
my God. And you'll sort of forget a country.
00:23:09.539 --> 00:23:12.200
And then you just have to change your sentence
00:23:12.200 --> 00:23:16.259
in the middle of a sentence to not talk yourself
00:23:16.259 --> 00:23:19.180
into a corner that you can't get out of. So you
00:23:19.180 --> 00:23:22.900
tend to think very quickly while speaking in
00:23:22.900 --> 00:23:27.019
a very measured way. And you can't offend people.
00:23:27.359 --> 00:23:30.279
That's the trickiest one is something you might
00:23:30.279 --> 00:23:35.420
think is fine. It's probably if it's on the edge,
00:23:35.599 --> 00:23:39.099
somebody will think that you're being rude for
00:23:39.099 --> 00:23:42.480
some reason. I'll give you another example. There's
00:23:42.480 --> 00:23:46.900
a very good, very strong young climber in Canada,
00:23:47.039 --> 00:23:49.779
Evangelina Briggs. She's a national champion.
00:23:49.900 --> 00:23:53.680
She's the youth champion. She is an absolute
00:23:53.680 --> 00:23:59.960
monster competing. She is also a mask. She climbs
00:23:59.960 --> 00:24:07.700
like stoic, serious, almost no emotion. I said
00:24:07.700 --> 00:24:11.279
she topped the boulder. I think the boulder she
00:24:11.279 --> 00:24:14.400
knew was going to be the win and had this tiny
00:24:14.400 --> 00:24:16.779
little crack of a smile as she turned around
00:24:16.779 --> 00:24:19.000
on the camera. I was like, oh, that's you can
00:24:19.000 --> 00:24:20.559
tell that smile. She's going to be happy with
00:24:20.559 --> 00:24:24.420
that. And somebody put in the comments. in quotes,
00:24:24.559 --> 00:24:27.819
you'd be prettier if you smiled more. As if that's
00:24:27.819 --> 00:24:33.299
what I was alluding to. It blew up. And I had
00:24:33.299 --> 00:24:34.920
to go and defend that and be like, that's not,
00:24:34.960 --> 00:24:36.339
and I brought it up. I think I even brought it
00:24:36.339 --> 00:24:39.319
up on the, like, you know, the next broadcast
00:24:39.319 --> 00:24:42.240
I did because I'm like, that's not what I'm talking
00:24:42.240 --> 00:24:44.980
about. Emotion is fine. Like I'll mention if
00:24:44.980 --> 00:24:47.160
there's a male climber that smiles, that never
00:24:47.160 --> 00:24:49.779
smiles or shows emotion or doesn't show emotion.
00:24:49.920 --> 00:24:53.059
Emotion is not male or female. Emotional is not
00:24:53.059 --> 00:24:55.880
rude or not rude. It's a descriptive fact about
00:24:55.880 --> 00:24:58.119
an individual or a sport or whatever it is. So
00:24:58.119 --> 00:25:02.259
to think that you have to explain that, you have
00:25:02.259 --> 00:25:04.599
to be ready for people to take what you've said
00:25:04.599 --> 00:25:08.220
and twist it with their own version or their
00:25:08.220 --> 00:25:11.599
own bias and then apply that bias to you. And
00:25:11.599 --> 00:25:15.119
even if you don't have it, you have to look in
00:25:15.119 --> 00:25:19.480
first and go, okay, am I applying a bias that
00:25:19.480 --> 00:25:22.200
I didn't think I had? And do I need to change
00:25:22.200 --> 00:25:24.000
the way I address things like this in the future?
00:25:24.039 --> 00:25:27.099
Or is that person just on a little island all
00:25:27.099 --> 00:25:29.319
by themselves and no one else thinks that I said
00:25:29.319 --> 00:25:31.480
something offensive? And in that instance, the.
00:25:32.059 --> 00:25:34.339
The Rosanna people in the chat, people were texting
00:25:34.339 --> 00:25:36.640
me like female friends from across North America
00:25:36.640 --> 00:25:38.500
were like, you're good. Like, don't stress it.
00:25:38.559 --> 00:25:40.619
I guess in those cases, it's also hard because
00:25:40.619 --> 00:25:42.859
then maybe one person would say it and then a
00:25:42.859 --> 00:25:44.940
bunch of other people who didn't even have it
00:25:44.940 --> 00:25:46.599
in their mind would see it and then be like,
00:25:46.680 --> 00:25:49.720
oh, maybe. And I talked about, you know, there's
00:25:49.720 --> 00:25:52.480
the World Cup in Salt Lake City where Mejdi topped
00:25:52.480 --> 00:25:54.519
the boulder and spiked his chalk bag and it bounced
00:25:54.519 --> 00:25:56.920
like four feet up in the air. Right. That's raw
00:25:56.920 --> 00:25:59.660
emotion. You know, what a story I just told you
00:25:59.660 --> 00:26:01.400
about Jacob knocking me over on the mats. That's
00:26:01.400 --> 00:26:03.940
raw emotion. And I think we should be able to
00:26:03.940 --> 00:26:06.140
talk about that without worrying that we're,
00:26:06.140 --> 00:26:10.140
you know, that we're, we're applying an emotional
00:26:10.140 --> 00:26:13.880
reaction to a gender specifically, instead of
00:26:13.880 --> 00:26:15.660
that's just happens to be the person we're talking
00:26:15.660 --> 00:26:19.579
about in the moment. So yeah, it's a, there's
00:26:19.579 --> 00:26:21.859
little pitfalls everywhere. So I've learned to
00:26:21.859 --> 00:26:24.539
be a little bit more careful, a little bit more
00:26:24.539 --> 00:26:29.710
measured, do more homework. try and understand
00:26:29.710 --> 00:26:34.289
um where you don't get to just have your own
00:26:34.289 --> 00:26:35.869
opinion so i don't just get to say that's not
00:26:35.869 --> 00:26:39.190
offensive i have to have i have to have like
00:26:39.190 --> 00:26:42.569
consensus so if it's even you know i'm thinking
00:26:42.569 --> 00:26:45.690
about it or talking about it and either in retrospect
00:26:45.690 --> 00:26:50.650
or you know in planning i just you apply a different
00:26:50.650 --> 00:26:53.150
lens which is a lot of people i mean will cups
00:26:53.150 --> 00:26:56.339
get broadcast on like 57 channels, the cable
00:26:56.339 --> 00:26:58.859
channels across Europe, like hundreds of thousands
00:26:58.859 --> 00:27:00.859
of people watch World Cups. So my first World
00:27:00.859 --> 00:27:05.539
Cup, I was like, this is not 800 people watching
00:27:05.539 --> 00:27:08.680
on YouTube. Yeah. How did the Salt Lake commentary
00:27:08.680 --> 00:27:13.720
go? You did it in 2021, 2022? And two, yeah.
00:27:13.819 --> 00:27:18.619
It was amazing. It was so good. It was the, it
00:27:18.619 --> 00:27:22.240
was the, what I had been trying to achieve since
00:27:22.240 --> 00:27:24.359
I started doing commentary was like, you know,
00:27:24.359 --> 00:27:26.359
I want to take this as far as it goes, which
00:27:26.359 --> 00:27:30.619
is the World Cup. I was super lucky to have Megan
00:27:30.619 --> 00:27:35.019
as my co -chair. She's just so smart and so invested
00:27:35.019 --> 00:27:38.039
and being in the US and she's friends with like
00:27:38.039 --> 00:27:41.119
all of the athletes. So she had this like energy
00:27:41.119 --> 00:27:42.940
about her of like, I get to watch my friends
00:27:42.940 --> 00:27:45.480
compete and talk about them on TV. Like this
00:27:45.480 --> 00:27:47.940
is the greatest thing ever. So her energy was
00:27:47.940 --> 00:27:52.480
super infectious and the crew was. And they treated
00:27:52.480 --> 00:27:54.500
me as though I'd been doing it for 10 years,
00:27:54.579 --> 00:27:57.079
which I had been. So that was like, it wasn't
00:27:57.079 --> 00:27:59.319
like, oh, you're new. What do we do now? It was,
00:27:59.319 --> 00:28:03.279
oh, you're just new to this chair. And the professionalism,
00:28:03.279 --> 00:28:06.119
the timing, the voice in the ear, like the way
00:28:06.119 --> 00:28:10.740
the run, everything is like almost to the second.
00:28:11.240 --> 00:28:13.740
It makes it like a really enjoyable experience.
00:28:13.740 --> 00:28:19.160
The climbing was amazing. I mean, one of my favorite
00:28:19.160 --> 00:28:21.160
things, you think you have this idea or maybe
00:28:21.160 --> 00:28:22.559
people that haven't seen a lot of competitions.
00:28:22.680 --> 00:28:24.480
And I did a little behind the scenes with my
00:28:24.480 --> 00:28:26.619
friend Tyler, who has Plastic Weekly, which is
00:28:26.619 --> 00:28:31.039
a show at the last Salt Week Wilcox that I did.
00:28:31.319 --> 00:28:33.859
We did a behind the scenes and I was like, here's
00:28:33.859 --> 00:28:35.579
the commentary table. And it was like a folding
00:28:35.579 --> 00:28:39.119
picnic table, like in the dirt, like in the corner,
00:28:39.259 --> 00:28:41.400
like behind some cabling and like a light post.
00:28:42.079 --> 00:28:44.099
He's like, it's not glamorous. You're not, not
00:28:44.099 --> 00:28:47.059
all venues have like, you know. a commentary
00:28:47.059 --> 00:28:49.539
area. So there's this idea that you're like,
00:28:49.599 --> 00:28:51.500
oh, I wonder what the, what the booth is going
00:28:51.500 --> 00:28:53.140
to be like. And I have a picture from the finals
00:28:53.140 --> 00:28:56.220
and they put backdrop for the kiss and cry, like
00:28:56.220 --> 00:28:57.720
where they have the kind of who's sitting in
00:28:57.720 --> 00:29:00.500
first place. And they had the, like the USA climbing
00:29:00.500 --> 00:29:03.880
kind of screen in front of the broadcast table.
00:29:04.140 --> 00:29:07.180
So I had this picture of the monitors and a black
00:29:07.180 --> 00:29:10.519
screen. That was our view for the final. We could
00:29:10.519 --> 00:29:12.539
not see the boulders and we were eight feet away
00:29:12.539 --> 00:29:15.819
from. the boulders so um there's you don't get
00:29:15.819 --> 00:29:17.680
this big sudden jump like oh i'm doing world
00:29:17.680 --> 00:29:19.819
cups now we're gonna be in like you know oak
00:29:19.819 --> 00:29:22.480
chairs and like this wonderful environment like
00:29:22.480 --> 00:29:25.359
no it's still like the money gets spent where
00:29:25.359 --> 00:29:26.859
it's supposed to be spent and you're gonna sit
00:29:26.859 --> 00:29:29.160
in a plastic chair on a folding picnic table
00:29:29.160 --> 00:29:30.779
and you're gonna like it and it's gonna be fine
00:29:30.779 --> 00:29:33.640
but the experience was amazing and it just made
00:29:33.640 --> 00:29:37.410
me want to do more it would be nice to see like
00:29:37.410 --> 00:29:40.410
a nice commentary booth like they have in like
00:29:40.410 --> 00:29:42.390
the NFL or something where they're like all sat
00:29:42.390 --> 00:29:45.369
around and there's like a whole row of commentators
00:29:45.369 --> 00:29:47.170
and they all, yeah, I don't know. That would
00:29:47.170 --> 00:29:48.930
be nice. And if someone running stats to you
00:29:48.930 --> 00:29:51.349
and yeah, absolutely. I agree. That would be
00:29:51.349 --> 00:29:53.769
great. I think I was going to say this for a
00:29:53.769 --> 00:29:55.309
bit later, but since we're talking about Salt
00:29:55.309 --> 00:29:58.950
Lake City right now, I think you had an interesting
00:29:58.950 --> 00:30:02.569
anecdote about, I think the setting at Salt Lake
00:30:02.569 --> 00:30:06.940
in terms of like difficulty. Please excuse this
00:30:06.940 --> 00:30:09.400
brief intermission. In order to keep this episode
00:30:09.400 --> 00:30:12.039
a bit more focused on a few topics, I had to
00:30:12.039 --> 00:30:14.279
cut out a lot of really interesting conversation
00:30:14.279 --> 00:30:17.819
about remote commentary and commentating for
00:30:17.819 --> 00:30:20.940
new viewership. If you'd like to unlock that
00:30:20.940 --> 00:30:23.799
video along with over four hours of bonus content,
00:30:24.059 --> 00:30:26.900
do consider helping support this podcast on Patreon.
00:30:27.279 --> 00:30:30.140
Some other perks include a membership pin shipped
00:30:30.140 --> 00:30:32.559
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00:30:32.599 --> 00:30:34.819
or the ability to submit video questions. questions
00:30:34.819 --> 00:30:38.380
and more to come the proceeds go back into the
00:30:38.380 --> 00:30:41.339
podcast help me break even and they help me improve
00:30:41.339 --> 00:30:44.160
the experience of the guests if you'd like to
00:30:44.160 --> 00:30:47.099
help out non -monetarily liking commenting and
00:30:47.099 --> 00:30:49.880
sharing helps a great deal as well back to the
00:30:49.880 --> 00:30:54.240
show it's into the conversation about how root
00:30:54.240 --> 00:30:57.599
setting is so integral and we know this but how
00:30:57.599 --> 00:31:01.559
the nuances of root setting are the important
00:31:01.559 --> 00:31:05.119
part about high level competition climbing. The,
00:31:05.240 --> 00:31:08.640
I've talked to so many root setters over so many
00:31:08.640 --> 00:31:12.880
years and been so invested in the, the care that
00:31:12.880 --> 00:31:19.019
they put in to every hold is real. Um, and their,
00:31:19.019 --> 00:31:22.799
their goal, and I'm a long time ago, so I'm good
00:31:22.799 --> 00:31:25.059
friends with a root setter named Tonde Cotillo,
00:31:25.180 --> 00:31:28.099
who's one of the best root setters that's ever
00:31:28.099 --> 00:31:31.380
done the job. And We would just talk about climbing
00:31:31.380 --> 00:31:32.700
and root setting and stuff. And I remember saying
00:31:32.700 --> 00:31:35.519
something about, oh, it's climbers versus root
00:31:35.519 --> 00:31:37.880
setters. And he was like, it's not. It's not.
00:31:38.420 --> 00:31:41.619
It's root setters creating movement that they
00:31:41.619 --> 00:31:45.839
want to see done, but not by everyone. So you
00:31:45.839 --> 00:31:50.140
have to create risk and you have to create room
00:31:50.140 --> 00:31:51.700
for error and you have to create falls and you
00:31:51.700 --> 00:31:53.660
have to steal time and you have to steal confidence
00:31:53.660 --> 00:31:55.460
and you have to kind of take all these things
00:31:55.460 --> 00:31:58.099
from climbers so they don't all just storm up
00:31:58.099 --> 00:32:00.599
all your boulders. So they want to see them get
00:32:00.599 --> 00:32:03.539
done, but not by everyone. So now the level is
00:32:03.539 --> 00:32:06.079
really difficult. If the temperature changes
00:32:06.079 --> 00:32:09.460
10 or 15 degrees or it rains an hour before the
00:32:09.460 --> 00:32:12.480
final, all of those boulders get harder or easier
00:32:12.480 --> 00:32:14.940
and you can't tweak them half an hour before
00:32:14.940 --> 00:32:16.920
the final. So there's so many factors that go
00:32:16.920 --> 00:32:19.279
into that. There was a slab in the semifinal
00:32:19.279 --> 00:32:23.000
in Salt Lake that no one did. None of the male
00:32:23.000 --> 00:32:25.619
finalists or semifinalists, finalists? I can't
00:32:25.619 --> 00:32:28.230
remember from one. I think it was a semifinal.
00:32:28.250 --> 00:32:30.029
I think you mentioned it was semis, yeah. Yeah.
00:32:31.549 --> 00:32:33.650
And people in the tower were like, oh, the slab
00:32:33.650 --> 00:32:36.750
was too hard. And I talked to the chief and he
00:32:36.750 --> 00:32:40.990
was like, the slab was V6. You just, you have
00:32:40.990 --> 00:32:43.509
to, nobody decided to trust the foot they had
00:32:43.509 --> 00:32:45.869
to trust to lean across to do the rock over to
00:32:45.869 --> 00:32:47.609
do the boulder. It's like the boulder wasn't
00:32:47.609 --> 00:32:50.250
that hard. They just collectively as a group
00:32:50.250 --> 00:32:53.730
didn't do their job. You know, you can, you set
00:32:53.730 --> 00:32:55.650
the boulders, you set them out and you're like,
00:32:55.710 --> 00:32:57.849
everybody go. And sometimes all the climbers
00:32:57.849 --> 00:32:59.410
are on the same page and they're dialed in and
00:32:59.410 --> 00:33:01.269
they're crushing it and everything's perfect.
00:33:01.910 --> 00:33:05.730
And sometimes collectively they don't climb the
00:33:05.730 --> 00:33:08.549
boulders well. And then we get this conversation
00:33:08.549 --> 00:33:11.210
where people say the setting was, so people will
00:33:11.210 --> 00:33:14.309
say this, the setting at Salt Lake was too easy
00:33:14.309 --> 00:33:17.690
or the setting in Salt Lake was too hard. And
00:33:17.690 --> 00:33:20.910
I don't, I cannot abide by that. If you want
00:33:20.910 --> 00:33:27.150
to talk about. The third semifinal boulder was
00:33:27.150 --> 00:33:29.849
a little bit too easy. I feel like, you know,
00:33:29.849 --> 00:33:33.029
maybe that sloper could have been worse. Now
00:33:33.029 --> 00:33:35.710
we can have a conversation about route setting
00:33:35.710 --> 00:33:38.710
and how the depth of understanding you need to
00:33:38.710 --> 00:33:41.470
get to, to know why a boulder gets sent or not
00:33:41.470 --> 00:33:44.009
sent by six people or eight people or 10 people
00:33:44.009 --> 00:33:47.769
or 20 people. But putting these blanket expressions
00:33:47.769 --> 00:33:50.420
across, so the route setting was too easy. It's
00:33:50.420 --> 00:33:51.900
like maybe two of the boulders were too easy,
00:33:51.960 --> 00:33:54.079
but do you want to see four tops in a final or
00:33:54.079 --> 00:33:56.119
two tops in a final? And do you want to see,
00:33:56.140 --> 00:33:58.019
if you see four tops in a final, do you want
00:33:58.019 --> 00:34:01.359
to see five finalists top four boulders? Or do
00:34:01.359 --> 00:34:03.160
you want to see one finalist top two boulders
00:34:03.160 --> 00:34:06.339
and five finalists top zero boulders? That's
00:34:06.339 --> 00:34:08.840
how thin the lines are with World Cup level route
00:34:08.840 --> 00:34:12.579
setting. The athletes are too good. And it's
00:34:12.579 --> 00:34:14.340
hard to confuse them. It's hard to trick them.
00:34:14.579 --> 00:34:16.719
And it's hard to make them fall off. And then
00:34:16.719 --> 00:34:19.780
you get... People come up with new hold designs
00:34:19.780 --> 00:34:21.860
to try and be like, hey, this is going to make
00:34:21.860 --> 00:34:23.699
it hard to see where the boot rubber is or hard
00:34:23.699 --> 00:34:25.980
to see where the no -tex is. And people write
00:34:25.980 --> 00:34:28.360
in the comments, that's dangerous. Oh, people
00:34:28.360 --> 00:34:30.400
are so mad. It's not dangerous to have no -tex,
00:34:30.420 --> 00:34:33.219
right? Like the zebras that made their debut,
00:34:33.380 --> 00:34:37.820
clear holds. Like we, as collectively as fans
00:34:37.820 --> 00:34:40.820
and consumers of competition climbing, if we're
00:34:40.820 --> 00:34:44.980
not ready for innovation, we're stunting the...
00:34:45.179 --> 00:34:47.960
people whose job it is to build a sport were
00:34:47.960 --> 00:34:53.460
taking that away from them. And I have this like
00:34:53.460 --> 00:34:56.360
core memory of competing when I was younger.
00:34:56.719 --> 00:34:59.380
And there's a set of holds and we mostly competed
00:34:59.380 --> 00:35:01.940
on roots. There wasn't a ton of bouldering in
00:35:01.940 --> 00:35:03.840
that era and it kind of just came into more and
00:35:03.840 --> 00:35:06.579
more. But there was a set of holds that from
00:35:06.579 --> 00:35:08.820
the bottom all looked exactly the same. They
00:35:08.820 --> 00:35:11.400
were half moons with no texture on the bottom,
00:35:11.519 --> 00:35:14.389
which was a thing. Back in the late 90s, early
00:35:14.389 --> 00:35:18.329
2000s, there was no text then. And from the bottom,
00:35:18.349 --> 00:35:19.949
they all look the same, but one was a sloper
00:35:19.949 --> 00:35:22.730
and one was flat and one was in cut. So when
00:35:22.730 --> 00:35:24.369
you're reading a competition from the ground,
00:35:24.429 --> 00:35:26.869
you're like, oh, that's the good one. And you
00:35:26.869 --> 00:35:28.489
get there and it's the flat one and you come
00:35:28.489 --> 00:35:33.170
off. We put tape on the inside of holds so they
00:35:33.170 --> 00:35:35.809
were slippery. So something you thought was a
00:35:35.809 --> 00:35:37.989
bucket now has duct tape inside of it and it's
00:35:37.989 --> 00:35:41.710
slippery. They used to re -pour well -known shapes.
00:35:42.400 --> 00:35:45.119
For the PCA comps, the pusher open down in Salt
00:35:45.119 --> 00:35:47.340
Lake City, the pusher was in the town. They'd
00:35:47.340 --> 00:35:50.639
be like, they would remold a hold you thought
00:35:50.639 --> 00:35:52.539
you already knew. You're like, oh, I know that
00:35:52.539 --> 00:35:55.380
pinch. It's super good inside. No, it's two inches
00:35:55.380 --> 00:36:00.179
fatter. So that's how we have to evolve. So root
00:36:00.179 --> 00:36:03.260
setting evolves, hold shaping evolves, climbers
00:36:03.260 --> 00:36:06.360
evolve. And then it has to go back the other
00:36:06.360 --> 00:36:09.159
way. So like, okay, climbers are too good at
00:36:09.159 --> 00:36:12.420
small crimps really far away. What do we do?
00:36:12.760 --> 00:36:14.599
Now we have volumes. Now we have runny jumps.
00:36:14.719 --> 00:36:17.679
Now we have, you know, triple coordination paddle
00:36:17.679 --> 00:36:20.159
dynos. Climbers are getting really good at that.
00:36:20.360 --> 00:36:23.320
I was talking to Mikael Mauem at the Dockmasters
00:36:23.320 --> 00:36:24.820
this year. And I was like, what if we just, if
00:36:24.820 --> 00:36:27.960
you set like a really hard, like terrible crimp
00:36:27.960 --> 00:36:29.599
boulder, it was like some of these guys couldn't
00:36:29.599 --> 00:36:33.179
do it. So route setting, does it swing back to
00:36:33.179 --> 00:36:35.579
1990 where all the holds are like a quarter pad
00:36:35.579 --> 00:36:38.340
and really far away, but then eventually everyone
00:36:38.340 --> 00:36:42.090
catches up. So I think route setting as a, as
00:36:42.090 --> 00:36:44.329
an art form and as a core piece of that puzzle,
00:36:44.469 --> 00:36:48.769
has to be understood. And I think that broadcasting
00:36:48.769 --> 00:36:53.030
allows that kind of peek behind the scenes to
00:36:53.030 --> 00:36:55.309
get, you know, oh, this is what actually happens.
00:36:55.389 --> 00:36:56.630
They didn't just throw the boulders up and walk
00:36:56.630 --> 00:36:59.110
away. This is how much they cared. I've seen
00:36:59.110 --> 00:37:03.349
Root Setters after comps like this. Like, I can't
00:37:03.349 --> 00:37:05.269
believe the last boulder was too hard. So they're
00:37:05.269 --> 00:37:07.010
their own worst critic. And yet there's people
00:37:07.010 --> 00:37:08.389
out, you know, hammering away on the YouTube
00:37:08.389 --> 00:37:10.130
comments saying their Root Setters don't know
00:37:10.130 --> 00:37:12.969
what they're doing. Maybe the root setters at
00:37:12.969 --> 00:37:15.289
your home gym who have been root setting for
00:37:15.289 --> 00:37:18.909
a year might set boulders you don't like. But
00:37:18.909 --> 00:37:20.550
these root setters have been that's their entire
00:37:20.550 --> 00:37:22.409
life's passion. It's their life's work and their
00:37:22.409 --> 00:37:25.110
job is to create the playing field that we get
00:37:25.110 --> 00:37:29.130
to consume. So for me, root setting is this.
00:37:30.409 --> 00:37:34.210
It's so important that we continue to have an
00:37:34.210 --> 00:37:36.530
education platform for people consuming high
00:37:36.530 --> 00:37:39.750
level competition about how difficult it is.
00:37:40.170 --> 00:37:42.789
set for this level of climber. Do you know how
00:37:42.789 --> 00:37:47.329
often nowadays root setters do these little tricks
00:37:47.329 --> 00:37:50.650
like pouring a new hold or something like that?
00:37:50.730 --> 00:37:53.630
I've only heard of setters saying that they would
00:37:53.630 --> 00:37:56.070
like sand down a hold so that the texture was
00:37:56.070 --> 00:37:58.409
a little worse, but I don't even know how often
00:37:58.409 --> 00:38:02.829
that happens actually. It happens when their
00:38:02.829 --> 00:38:05.909
vision for a boulder doesn't have the hold in
00:38:05.909 --> 00:38:08.679
the hold room that they need. So you're like,
00:38:08.719 --> 00:38:11.239
I really need a hold of this size with no texture.
00:38:11.539 --> 00:38:15.199
It doesn't exist. Go get me the sander. I'm going
00:38:15.199 --> 00:38:17.780
to grind the texture off of this one. I have
00:38:17.780 --> 00:38:19.739
a picture of my friend Caleb at the Doc Masters
00:38:19.739 --> 00:38:22.920
a couple of years ago, like just on a slab, just
00:38:22.920 --> 00:38:26.719
like, but he wanted the hold smaller. So it was
00:38:26.719 --> 00:38:28.719
a little nubbin and it was too big, but they
00:38:28.719 --> 00:38:30.460
didn't have anything smaller and they didn't
00:38:30.460 --> 00:38:32.780
want like a big dish that was like flat. They
00:38:32.780 --> 00:38:35.820
wanted low profile aesthetic. And so he just
00:38:35.820 --> 00:38:39.690
basically just cut the top off. And you see blockers
00:38:39.690 --> 00:38:41.570
all the time, right? So you take a hold that's
00:38:41.570 --> 00:38:43.250
pretty good and you block half of it. So like,
00:38:43.269 --> 00:38:45.550
I really wish I had a three pad crimp that you
00:38:45.550 --> 00:38:48.170
couldn't match. Like, I'll just block it. So
00:38:48.170 --> 00:38:51.789
that's the easier trick is to take things around
00:38:51.789 --> 00:38:54.469
the gym and do a little construction work, a
00:38:54.469 --> 00:38:57.349
little bricolage, and then you can do what you
00:38:57.349 --> 00:39:01.309
can do. It's pretty hard to decide to re -pour
00:39:01.309 --> 00:39:04.590
holds, but you have whole companies that will
00:39:04.590 --> 00:39:08.809
not release holds. to the public until after
00:39:08.809 --> 00:39:11.989
they've used them in competition. So you're like,
00:39:12.030 --> 00:39:13.690
oh, like Flat Hold made the Z. They're like,
00:39:13.769 --> 00:39:15.889
oh, we made these new holds. Let's put them in
00:39:15.889 --> 00:39:18.849
competition and then we'll sell them. So no one's
00:39:18.849 --> 00:39:21.150
climbed on these holds. No one's trained on them.
00:39:21.250 --> 00:39:23.469
No one's grabbed it. The first time you grab
00:39:23.469 --> 00:39:25.550
it is your first attempt on that finals boulder.
00:39:25.809 --> 00:39:27.670
And that's stressful. So now you create risk,
00:39:27.710 --> 00:39:29.690
you create anxiety simply by putting something
00:39:29.690 --> 00:39:33.369
brand new where you're like, what is that? And
00:39:33.369 --> 00:39:34.969
you see them climb. You see them. If you watch
00:39:34.969 --> 00:39:38.539
them preview, they're like. what did we do with
00:39:38.539 --> 00:39:40.480
that? Like, I guess you just hope it's good.
00:39:40.920 --> 00:39:42.940
Or you see somebody jump to something that's
00:39:42.940 --> 00:39:44.659
definitely not a hold you could jump to. And
00:39:44.659 --> 00:39:46.420
then they're like, that's not what I thought
00:39:46.420 --> 00:39:50.179
it was. Okay. Good to know. Okay. So moving on
00:39:50.179 --> 00:39:52.039
into something else you're pretty passionate
00:39:52.039 --> 00:39:54.139
about. You mentioned you're a big proponent of
00:39:54.139 --> 00:39:56.880
non -sanctioned comps. So non -IFSC related.
00:39:57.760 --> 00:39:59.699
Why do you think they're so valuable to the community?
00:40:00.820 --> 00:40:02.539
Yeah, it is one of my favorite things to talk
00:40:02.539 --> 00:40:04.980
about and maybe more in recent years. And it's
00:40:04.980 --> 00:40:08.340
not I'm just going to put my broadcast mask back
00:40:08.340 --> 00:40:10.599
on and be like, this is not a knock on the IFSC.
00:40:10.900 --> 00:40:13.000
Obviously, we should have World Cup level competitions.
00:40:13.619 --> 00:40:17.579
Like, it's not a one or the other scenario. So
00:40:17.579 --> 00:40:20.059
just we put that caveat, the disclaimer out of
00:40:20.059 --> 00:40:22.480
the way. Yeah. Little asterisk on the corner.
00:40:22.559 --> 00:40:26.159
Like, don't misquote me, please, if you're watching
00:40:26.159 --> 00:40:31.360
this. But it's exclusive. Um, even people that
00:40:31.360 --> 00:40:33.800
like to compete won't go to a national championship
00:40:33.800 --> 00:40:36.219
because they'll probably get rocked and you got
00:40:36.219 --> 00:40:39.679
to spend a lot of money to go and you, your competition
00:40:39.679 --> 00:40:43.500
experience is, um, you know, the first three
00:40:43.500 --> 00:40:45.739
moves of two boulders in the qualifier. And then
00:40:45.739 --> 00:40:48.000
you're like, great. I'm glad I trained all year
00:40:48.000 --> 00:40:52.480
for that. Um, so the high level competition is
00:40:52.480 --> 00:40:57.380
the bar. Um, and then. For sanctioned local competitions,
00:40:57.599 --> 00:40:59.960
you still need to be committed enough to pay
00:40:59.960 --> 00:41:02.280
into your federation, to pay into your state
00:41:02.280 --> 00:41:06.860
or province, wherever you live, and be in that
00:41:06.860 --> 00:41:10.380
space. You need to be a competitor. And not everyone
00:41:10.380 --> 00:41:13.119
likes to do that. But some people think competing
00:41:13.119 --> 00:41:16.500
is fun. And I think that non -sanctioned comps,
00:41:16.500 --> 00:41:21.280
local comps, festival comps, and, you know, something
00:41:21.280 --> 00:41:23.489
we'll kind of, maybe I'll sort of... talk to
00:41:23.489 --> 00:41:25.070
them more at the end because we can tip into
00:41:25.070 --> 00:41:27.710
that um comps that allow you to make money to
00:41:27.710 --> 00:41:30.590
continue climbing as a professional climber those
00:41:30.590 --> 00:41:35.150
are critical pieces of the the roots and the
00:41:35.150 --> 00:41:37.449
growth of the sport because it makes competition
00:41:37.449 --> 00:41:42.289
accessible and it makes people maybe grow an
00:41:42.289 --> 00:41:44.429
interest in it which maybe makes them go and
00:41:44.429 --> 00:41:47.050
watch a world cup um which builds viewership
00:41:47.050 --> 00:41:49.159
which means that you can get sponsorship which
00:41:49.159 --> 00:41:51.000
means that you can pay athletes more which means
00:41:51.000 --> 00:41:53.139
you can put on a better broadcast the dominoes
00:41:53.139 --> 00:41:57.500
continue and they start at your local gym putting
00:41:57.500 --> 00:42:01.840
on a comp series that costs you 30 bucks and
00:42:01.840 --> 00:42:04.179
they said 40 boulders and it's a fun scramble
00:42:04.179 --> 00:42:06.940
and you're going to win a chalk bag or a couple
00:42:06.940 --> 00:42:08.980
brushes or a t -shirt from the local t -shirt
00:42:08.980 --> 00:42:14.579
guy and that idea that you can compete without
00:42:14.579 --> 00:42:17.909
needing to be a competitor I think is really
00:42:17.909 --> 00:42:21.050
important. You can compete because it's fun.
00:42:21.190 --> 00:42:24.409
And if you play other sports, every time you
00:42:24.409 --> 00:42:27.610
go play it, you're competing. Any team sport,
00:42:27.849 --> 00:42:29.889
you rec softball, anything you're doing as an
00:42:29.889 --> 00:42:32.429
adult or in university where you're no longer
00:42:32.429 --> 00:42:36.070
on a competitive team where there's people on
00:42:36.070 --> 00:42:37.670
the sidelines and coaches and all of those things,
00:42:37.730 --> 00:42:40.449
you're playing like an adult level or a rec sport
00:42:40.449 --> 00:42:44.550
or, you know, I'm sure. You know, every province,
00:42:44.570 --> 00:42:47.289
city, state has some version of, you know, a
00:42:47.289 --> 00:42:49.489
beer league, baseball or basketball or squash.
00:42:49.590 --> 00:42:51.750
You have all these things. You're always competing.
00:42:52.510 --> 00:42:54.150
And then you get to go out and throw the ball
00:42:54.150 --> 00:42:56.070
around sometimes. But I go and I play soccer
00:42:56.070 --> 00:42:59.150
on Saturdays on a soccer team. Or I go play beach
00:42:59.150 --> 00:43:01.269
volleyball at the beach on a team, you know,
00:43:01.269 --> 00:43:03.710
every Sunday. But when I go climbing, I just
00:43:03.710 --> 00:43:05.150
go to the gym and I try all the problems and
00:43:05.150 --> 00:43:08.420
I go home. So it gives you a chance to go and
00:43:08.420 --> 00:43:10.519
be in this kind of a little bit hyped up environment.
00:43:10.679 --> 00:43:12.300
Maybe they turn the lights off. Maybe there's
00:43:12.300 --> 00:43:15.059
a DJ. Maybe you have an MC. Maybe you feel like
00:43:15.059 --> 00:43:17.519
there's a hundred or 50 or 20 people watching
00:43:17.519 --> 00:43:19.699
you climb a boulder. And you're like, this is
00:43:19.699 --> 00:43:21.559
a good time. Like, oh my goodness. I didn't know
00:43:21.559 --> 00:43:24.059
this adrenaline rush, this feeling of like, oh,
00:43:24.159 --> 00:43:25.780
I can't come back and try this boulder tomorrow.
00:43:26.260 --> 00:43:28.800
Oh, I can't, I can't work on it for an hour.
00:43:29.059 --> 00:43:31.199
I can't go outside and have a coffee and come
00:43:31.199 --> 00:43:33.239
back and be ready to climb it. I have four minutes.
00:43:34.079 --> 00:43:36.380
wow, this is exciting. This is testing everything
00:43:36.380 --> 00:43:40.440
I need to know. I coach locally and I coach people
00:43:40.440 --> 00:43:42.340
who are like, I think I want to maybe go into
00:43:42.340 --> 00:43:44.119
the triple threat. We have this comp series through
00:43:44.119 --> 00:43:45.900
the winter and the summer or they're, you know,
00:43:45.900 --> 00:43:50.360
Friday nights and we shut half the gym. So there's
00:43:50.360 --> 00:43:52.380
still people climbing and they're like, I go
00:43:52.380 --> 00:43:54.260
and I watch and I see people compete and I think
00:43:54.260 --> 00:43:55.619
I want to try it. Like, can you give me some
00:43:55.619 --> 00:43:57.840
tips on how to compete? Right. And I'm like,
00:43:57.880 --> 00:43:59.639
absolutely. This is what you want to talk about.
00:43:59.699 --> 00:44:00.840
This is what you think about it. People either
00:44:00.840 --> 00:44:02.360
come back going, that was the worst experience
00:44:02.360 --> 00:44:05.960
of my life. I wanted to cry the whole time. Or
00:44:05.960 --> 00:44:07.900
they come back and they go, I didn't think I
00:44:07.900 --> 00:44:09.199
was going to do that boulder. And then I did
00:44:09.199 --> 00:44:12.420
it. I don't think I've ever felt that in a session
00:44:12.420 --> 00:44:14.539
like, you know, on Tuesday afternoon with my
00:44:14.539 --> 00:44:19.579
friend. So you smash all of that together. And
00:44:19.579 --> 00:44:24.300
that's what local level competitions bring. And
00:44:24.300 --> 00:44:26.800
if you take it up a notch and you go. Festival
00:44:26.800 --> 00:44:28.480
comps, so comps that you would have to travel
00:44:28.480 --> 00:44:31.579
to that have a few other ones, like a Sequel
00:44:31.579 --> 00:44:34.780
Block, for example, or Adidas Rockstars or the
00:44:34.780 --> 00:44:38.500
Jackalope. It happens a couple of times a year
00:44:38.500 --> 00:44:40.840
in a couple of different places and has enough
00:44:40.840 --> 00:44:44.179
money that people will come to it. But not so
00:44:44.179 --> 00:44:48.360
much money that the finals will be full of people
00:44:48.360 --> 00:44:50.639
that have flown in for it. And now you have this
00:44:50.639 --> 00:44:52.920
really interesting play where you have people
00:44:52.920 --> 00:44:56.590
from wherever it is who made the final. And people
00:44:56.590 --> 00:44:59.630
who've come in from out of town or who are like
00:44:59.630 --> 00:45:02.369
a national level competitor. And now you get
00:45:02.369 --> 00:45:06.369
to see what the game is really like. And you're
00:45:06.369 --> 00:45:09.010
like, oh, I competed against this person and
00:45:09.010 --> 00:45:12.949
I couldn't do this boulder and they smoked it.
00:45:13.429 --> 00:45:16.269
Like, wow, that's how good they are. And then
00:45:16.269 --> 00:45:18.090
you think that person went to World Cups and
00:45:18.090 --> 00:45:21.570
came in 50th 10 times in a row. Okay, so how
00:45:21.570 --> 00:45:25.889
good is Meji? Right? How good is Johanna for
00:45:25.889 --> 00:45:29.610
real? What is like that magic number of like,
00:45:29.690 --> 00:45:33.110
you'll have some people come in, but like it's
00:45:33.110 --> 00:45:36.489
mostly locals. I mean, you have to have, I think
00:45:36.489 --> 00:45:38.389
you have to have at least $10 ,000 in prize money
00:45:38.389 --> 00:45:43.949
to get people to travel. That's, it seems to
00:45:43.949 --> 00:45:46.110
be, it should, you should be able to convince
00:45:46.110 --> 00:45:49.570
people for slightly less than that. But $10 ,000
00:45:49.570 --> 00:45:51.769
split between six people goes pretty quick too.
00:45:51.909 --> 00:45:55.599
So it's not like. you know, you're getting, you
00:45:55.599 --> 00:45:58.199
know, two and a half or 3000 for first and 500
00:45:58.199 --> 00:46:03.059
for third, you know, like it's, it's not, that's
00:46:03.059 --> 00:46:04.559
most people, if you're going to come a long way,
00:46:04.599 --> 00:46:07.320
that's your plane ticket. Um, if you have a comp
00:46:07.320 --> 00:46:09.719
that puts up that brings athletes in and maybe
00:46:09.719 --> 00:46:14.079
pay some of their travel. Um, so studio block
00:46:14.079 --> 00:46:16.400
doc masters, uh, I'm pretty sure if you have
00:46:16.400 --> 00:46:18.900
a world cup ranking, um, I think that's the bar.
00:46:18.940 --> 00:46:20.079
If you have a world cup ranking, they'll pay
00:46:20.079 --> 00:46:23.090
your hotel. Um, And if you have a sponsor that's
00:46:23.090 --> 00:46:25.170
paying for something for you or you have friends
00:46:25.170 --> 00:46:26.750
in the town that you can stay with, like there's
00:46:26.750 --> 00:46:28.489
all these reasons you would be like, okay, three
00:46:28.489 --> 00:46:30.030
grand is a difference. Do I think I can win?
00:46:30.489 --> 00:46:33.670
And so then how much does it cost to run these
00:46:33.670 --> 00:46:37.869
like bigger non -IFSC comps like Studio Block
00:46:37.869 --> 00:46:40.929
or Jackalope or something like that? Well, I
00:46:40.929 --> 00:46:42.010
guess that's kind of different because that's
00:46:42.010 --> 00:46:46.469
a whole festival. Yeah, and it's a good question,
00:46:46.489 --> 00:46:50.110
but it's a tricky question. There's so many.
00:46:50.849 --> 00:46:55.590
different ways to break that apart and a lot
00:46:55.590 --> 00:46:58.610
of it depends on sponsors and a lot of it depends
00:46:58.610 --> 00:47:01.570
on the model so you might have a model where
00:47:01.570 --> 00:47:05.269
people pay to be a part of it so the event itself
00:47:05.269 --> 00:47:07.829
isn't really putting out a lot of money but other
00:47:07.829 --> 00:47:10.750
people are or you have the competitors who are
00:47:10.750 --> 00:47:12.550
paying their way in or maybe the competitor fee
00:47:12.550 --> 00:47:15.650
is quite low so you have to have an understanding
00:47:15.650 --> 00:47:18.230
when you're trying to put on if you're trying
00:47:18.230 --> 00:47:21.159
to start a new event um what you can do with
00:47:21.159 --> 00:47:23.260
what you have how many volunteers do you have
00:47:23.260 --> 00:47:25.219
how many people do you have to pay are you paying
00:47:25.219 --> 00:47:27.000
your gym staff or you're saying hey it'd be great
00:47:27.000 --> 00:47:28.380
if you guys could volunteer and they all say
00:47:28.380 --> 00:47:31.519
never mind i'm not that excited about it you're
00:47:31.519 --> 00:47:34.900
like dude um so you do have all of those expenses
00:47:34.900 --> 00:47:37.380
if you stream it or not stream it um you're gonna
00:47:37.380 --> 00:47:40.599
tack on a 40 or 50 000 or 30 40 50 000 price
00:47:40.599 --> 00:47:45.500
ticket on top of that um it's not it it shouldn't
00:47:45.500 --> 00:47:49.300
surprise you that a big A big money comp that
00:47:49.300 --> 00:47:52.099
brings in international level athletes is going
00:47:52.099 --> 00:47:54.219
to cost you a hundred grand to put on. That's
00:47:54.219 --> 00:47:58.019
like similar to the budget for IFSC comps last
00:47:58.019 --> 00:48:00.900
that I heard, I think. Yeah. And then you get
00:48:00.900 --> 00:48:03.139
to offset it. So your decision to keep doing
00:48:03.139 --> 00:48:05.139
the event or to put the event on is what can
00:48:05.139 --> 00:48:08.679
I offset? Am I charging people to come in? Am
00:48:08.679 --> 00:48:11.860
I letting people watch for free? Do I have the
00:48:11.860 --> 00:48:14.750
sponsorship? to pay for the event or is, you
00:48:14.750 --> 00:48:17.389
know, do I have, am I okay with giving out? So
00:48:17.389 --> 00:48:20.210
a lot of sponsors would rather give stuff than
00:48:20.210 --> 00:48:23.590
money because an Arc'teryx backpack is worth
00:48:23.590 --> 00:48:27.610
$800, but it only costs them 100. So he's like,
00:48:27.690 --> 00:48:32.550
am I okay with giving finalists stuff that they're,
00:48:32.550 --> 00:48:35.190
you know, goes to get people that go, I want
00:48:35.190 --> 00:48:36.849
shoes. I'm like, great. I'm sponsored. Who wants
00:48:36.849 --> 00:48:40.510
my shoes? You have all of these tiered decisions
00:48:40.510 --> 00:48:44.469
about where to spend money and how to spend it
00:48:44.469 --> 00:48:47.949
and who's spending it. There's lots of different
00:48:47.949 --> 00:48:54.610
versions of that. I think the chicken and egg
00:48:54.610 --> 00:48:59.250
problem is if you spend all the money, people
00:48:59.250 --> 00:49:02.429
will come. And then if people come, you can then
00:49:02.429 --> 00:49:05.349
spend the money. So the Dockmasters, for example,
00:49:05.510 --> 00:49:09.389
I'll put it down as maybe... for me, top three
00:49:09.389 --> 00:49:16.349
in terms of organization and idea. So they have,
00:49:16.510 --> 00:49:19.969
it's a qualifier. So you can sign up to be in
00:49:19.969 --> 00:49:24.329
Open. You know, in the morning, you go and you
00:49:24.329 --> 00:49:27.610
compete with the pros and they take your top
00:49:27.610 --> 00:49:31.849
six climbs and 18 people go to, or 16, 15 people
00:49:31.849 --> 00:49:34.809
go to semifinals. So you just get to sign up,
00:49:34.849 --> 00:49:37.349
but you obviously pay as that as a competitor.
00:49:37.869 --> 00:49:41.489
Or there's a citizen's comp. So that's just for
00:49:41.489 --> 00:49:44.389
everyone else. But they have two citizen's comps.
00:49:44.889 --> 00:49:49.289
So they have one on Saturday and your entry into
00:49:49.289 --> 00:49:52.349
the citizen's comp is your ticket to the semifinal.
00:49:53.829 --> 00:49:57.210
So you compete in the citizen's comp. Then you
00:49:57.210 --> 00:50:00.170
get a meal ticket because you paid for food and
00:50:00.170 --> 00:50:02.690
beer and they have a caterer come in and you
00:50:02.690 --> 00:50:06.289
get like. The foods are really good. So you get
00:50:06.289 --> 00:50:09.210
a catered meal and a couple of beers and you
00:50:09.210 --> 00:50:11.489
don't leave the gym and you watch the semifinal.
00:50:12.909 --> 00:50:15.230
Anybody who's put on a comp, I know there's people
00:50:15.230 --> 00:50:18.090
listening to this who are like, everybody competes,
00:50:18.090 --> 00:50:20.570
then they go home and then they don't come back
00:50:20.570 --> 00:50:22.469
and watch the final. And then you have this sort
00:50:22.469 --> 00:50:24.670
of flat local environment where like 50 people
00:50:24.670 --> 00:50:27.070
watch a final where you could have had 200 if
00:50:27.070 --> 00:50:30.139
everyone that competed just stayed. So they've
00:50:30.139 --> 00:50:32.340
created this environment where the right thing
00:50:32.340 --> 00:50:34.320
to do, the better choice is to stay at the gym.
00:50:34.880 --> 00:50:37.280
And then the same on the, and they charge for
00:50:37.280 --> 00:50:40.280
finals tickets and people pay, they sell out.
00:50:41.320 --> 00:50:43.900
So people are like, yes, I would happily pay
00:50:43.900 --> 00:50:47.679
50 bucks to watch world cup competitors this
00:50:47.679 --> 00:50:51.500
far away. But not every climbing community has
00:50:51.500 --> 00:50:54.559
that. And the Dutch climbing community, I think
00:50:54.559 --> 00:50:57.099
it's most gyms per capita. They don't have a
00:50:57.099 --> 00:51:00.480
lot of rock climbing. in the netherlands so they
00:51:00.480 --> 00:51:03.039
have a ton of climbing gyms and then therefore
00:51:03.039 --> 00:51:05.000
you just sort of breed gym culture you breed
00:51:05.000 --> 00:51:07.679
competition culture and it just spreads out but
00:51:07.679 --> 00:51:10.219
having events like the dock masters on studio
00:51:10.219 --> 00:51:13.039
block masters adidas rock stars to some extent
00:51:13.039 --> 00:51:17.280
that provides this anchor of this is world cup
00:51:17.280 --> 00:51:20.179
level competition in the final and you get a
00:51:20.179 --> 00:51:23.400
chance to peek at it and try the boulders and
00:51:23.400 --> 00:51:25.500
qualify and there's always a couple locals that
00:51:25.500 --> 00:51:28.010
make the semi Because there's maybe six or eight
00:51:28.010 --> 00:51:30.369
World Cup athletes that will come. So there's
00:51:30.369 --> 00:51:33.829
room. There's room for you to make the semi and
00:51:33.829 --> 00:51:37.409
then get smashed on semifinals boulders and watch
00:51:37.409 --> 00:51:39.929
World Cup climbers just go, oh, yeah, I did the
00:51:39.929 --> 00:51:41.889
semifinals. It was fine. It was great. That top
00:51:41.889 --> 00:51:44.269
five boulders. And you're like, I couldn't start
00:51:44.269 --> 00:51:46.610
three of them. Yeah, I do kind of wish we had
00:51:46.610 --> 00:51:49.590
something like that. You mentioned that Punk
00:51:49.590 --> 00:51:52.409
Rock Masters is kind of a similar structure to
00:51:52.409 --> 00:51:56.409
that coming up. Yeah, this is. I'm so excited
00:51:56.409 --> 00:52:00.130
for this. I'm so excited. So Mark Bradley, who
00:52:00.130 --> 00:52:02.030
is the mind behind the Punk Rock Masters, he
00:52:02.030 --> 00:52:06.289
owns the whole room. He grew up, we're of the
00:52:06.289 --> 00:52:08.989
same era. He grew up where there was a lot, there
00:52:08.989 --> 00:52:11.789
was more sort of, we just competed locally. There's
00:52:11.789 --> 00:52:13.630
lots of competitions, grew up skateboarding.
00:52:14.010 --> 00:52:18.989
There was always a way to be like, I could do
00:52:18.989 --> 00:52:21.289
this. I could make money at this. This could
00:52:21.289 --> 00:52:22.969
be what I do for a living. I could be a climber.
00:52:23.030 --> 00:52:24.349
I could be a skateboarder. I could be X, Y, Z.
00:52:25.259 --> 00:52:30.739
And he also noticing sort of this gap in either
00:52:30.739 --> 00:52:32.380
you're competing at this level or you're competing
00:52:32.380 --> 00:52:35.179
at this level. And how do we create an environment
00:52:35.179 --> 00:52:38.920
where if it's not world cups, can you compete
00:52:38.920 --> 00:52:43.380
for enough money to make it worth it? Um, so
00:52:43.380 --> 00:52:46.760
he's hosting a comp, um, on, I'm going to make
00:52:46.760 --> 00:52:48.960
sure I get the date, right. Cause I don't want
00:52:48.960 --> 00:52:50.159
to get the day wrong. I don't have in front of
00:52:50.159 --> 00:52:54.389
me, October 11th in Huntington beach. And it's
00:52:54.389 --> 00:52:57.610
$50 ,000 in prize money. It's huge. Yeah. It's
00:52:57.610 --> 00:53:00.489
huge. It's the second most prize money of any
00:53:00.489 --> 00:53:04.409
Masters comp in the world. So the only one, there's
00:53:04.409 --> 00:53:07.650
a French comp, the Paris, I'm going to forget
00:53:07.650 --> 00:53:13.210
the name of it. And they had $100 ,000. Whoa.
00:53:13.409 --> 00:53:16.690
And the fact that, did you know about it? No,
00:53:16.690 --> 00:53:19.469
I haven't heard about it. Exactly. That's telling,
00:53:19.590 --> 00:53:22.420
right? Um, it got almost no social media. If
00:53:22.420 --> 00:53:24.059
you go to their Instagram page, they don't even
00:53:24.059 --> 00:53:27.579
have the winners. Whoa. So I, I, I was, we're
00:53:27.579 --> 00:53:29.079
going back and forth and Mark and I were talking
00:53:29.079 --> 00:53:31.159
about, he's like, I want to say that, um, this
00:53:31.159 --> 00:53:34.440
is the, the most prize money of any non -sanctioned
00:53:34.440 --> 00:53:38.199
comp, um, ever. I was like, we were talking about
00:53:38.199 --> 00:53:39.900
it. So I'm pretty sure this, sort of this comp
00:53:39.900 --> 00:53:41.880
in, in Paris was a hundred grand. And I texted
00:53:41.880 --> 00:53:45.000
Chloe Cosboy, who was, who was there. Uh, I pwned
00:53:45.000 --> 00:53:46.920
him. She's like, it was wild. It was a hundred
00:53:46.920 --> 00:53:49.260
grand. And every finalist. It wasn't just podium
00:53:49.260 --> 00:53:52.980
spots that got paid. Oh, nice. Yeah. So he's
00:53:52.980 --> 00:53:56.320
like, why not put the effort in? It's like a
00:53:56.320 --> 00:53:58.639
year and a half of planning and building sponsorship
00:53:58.639 --> 00:54:00.639
and doing all these things. Why not have a competition
00:54:00.639 --> 00:54:07.340
that brings in that mindset of you can make a
00:54:07.340 --> 00:54:11.280
living competing because we've put in the work
00:54:11.280 --> 00:54:14.420
to bring in the money that makes it worth it.
00:54:14.940 --> 00:54:17.639
And this the first time it's going to be it's.
00:54:17.980 --> 00:54:20.539
It's an invite. It's basically a final. So it's
00:54:20.539 --> 00:54:26.159
it's it's more there's no qualifier semifinal.
00:54:26.260 --> 00:54:29.860
It's just a final. Oh, wow. But it's on the beach.
00:54:29.980 --> 00:54:31.920
It's outside. And there's a punk rock show. So
00:54:31.920 --> 00:54:34.380
we're just he's just he's twisting it to be like,
00:54:34.460 --> 00:54:37.860
you know, we can have this amount of fun. And
00:54:37.860 --> 00:54:39.980
similar like the Jackalope is a skateboard comp.
00:54:40.139 --> 00:54:43.219
There's motocross, big air. There's bands playing
00:54:43.219 --> 00:54:46.119
DJs like it's this. Why wouldn't you want to
00:54:46.119 --> 00:54:48.619
go down to Huntington Beach? And watch some of
00:54:48.619 --> 00:54:50.159
the best climbers in the world. And the confirmed
00:54:50.159 --> 00:54:54.780
athletes, it's like Mejdi, Mika Mauem, Colin
00:54:54.780 --> 00:54:59.179
Duffy, Brooke Futaba, Tomoa, Fanny Jube. Like,
00:54:59.179 --> 00:55:02.579
this is the level that's going to be climbing
00:55:02.579 --> 00:55:06.599
at this comp. And the proof is that if you put
00:55:06.599 --> 00:55:10.980
the effort in and you build the stage, people
00:55:10.980 --> 00:55:14.400
will come. And that's that mindset is like, what
00:55:14.400 --> 00:55:17.880
if, like, what if I built the thing, um, and
00:55:17.880 --> 00:55:22.519
gave this reminder to the climbing community
00:55:22.519 --> 00:55:27.400
that it is possible to put on events that allow
00:55:27.400 --> 00:55:32.400
climbers to make money doing the thing they're
00:55:32.400 --> 00:55:34.920
good at. Cause not every climber has sponsorship
00:55:34.920 --> 00:55:37.380
that pays for their, their lifestyle. There's
00:55:37.380 --> 00:55:39.179
only a handful of people that can afford to climb
00:55:39.179 --> 00:55:43.260
full time. Um, and having like an enjoyable life
00:55:43.260 --> 00:55:46.320
out of it. Um, not everybody's winning world
00:55:46.320 --> 00:55:49.739
cups all the time. Um, so you want to have this
00:55:49.739 --> 00:55:51.340
other way to be like, oh, in the off season,
00:55:51.480 --> 00:55:52.840
you can go do these events. And the jackalope
00:55:52.840 --> 00:55:54.760
was a bit like that. So the sort of the climbers
00:55:54.760 --> 00:55:58.199
that are around in North America during the jackalope
00:55:58.199 --> 00:56:00.460
events, because you're winning, you know, enough
00:56:00.460 --> 00:56:03.159
money to pay a couple months worth of rent, right.
00:56:03.219 --> 00:56:04.599
A couple of car payments and go, whatever it
00:56:04.599 --> 00:56:07.579
is, you know, three or two or $3 ,000 is not
00:56:07.579 --> 00:56:12.539
anything to laugh at when. climbing's ability
00:56:12.539 --> 00:56:15.300
to make money bar is unfortunately relatively
00:56:15.300 --> 00:56:21.199
low. So I think the value in having competitions
00:56:21.199 --> 00:56:25.000
like this, when you stack on community, you stack
00:56:25.000 --> 00:56:29.900
on exposure, you stack on the connection that
00:56:29.900 --> 00:56:33.800
people can gain by being closer and having a
00:56:33.800 --> 00:56:36.900
little more fun. So World Cups are amazing, but
00:56:36.900 --> 00:56:40.909
you... It's not the same because it's judges
00:56:40.909 --> 00:56:44.309
and rules and you can't do these things. The
00:56:44.309 --> 00:56:46.769
Jackalope, we have a different format where it
00:56:46.769 --> 00:56:49.389
was a session format. So we take three of the
00:56:49.389 --> 00:56:50.949
finalists and put them on the boulder for eight
00:56:50.949 --> 00:56:53.289
minutes together. So they just work the boulder.
00:56:54.250 --> 00:56:56.429
And now they get to go to a comp and hang out
00:56:56.429 --> 00:56:59.389
together instead of being isolated and being
00:56:59.389 --> 00:57:01.230
like, oh, I wish I'd seen you top that boulder.
00:57:01.289 --> 00:57:02.289
That would have been really cool. It's like,
00:57:02.309 --> 00:57:04.710
oh, I get to watch my friends compete in top
00:57:04.710 --> 00:57:06.960
boulders. And you put enough money in front of
00:57:06.960 --> 00:57:08.559
it that then people are like, oh, I want to do
00:57:08.559 --> 00:57:12.139
that. And now you kind of blur the lines between
00:57:12.139 --> 00:57:15.039
the chicken and the egg and say, do I want to
00:57:15.039 --> 00:57:19.860
go see Tomoa and Brooke and Fanny? And yeah,
00:57:20.099 --> 00:57:22.960
I do. Do I want to go see like on the beach?
00:57:23.219 --> 00:57:26.059
Yeah, I do. Do I want to not have to go through
00:57:26.059 --> 00:57:29.940
the hassle of traveling to Europe or, you know,
00:57:29.940 --> 00:57:32.380
only seeing the Salt Lake World Cup come up?
00:57:32.670 --> 00:57:34.630
Yeah, in North America, we don't have the same
00:57:34.630 --> 00:57:36.889
ability to be like, oh, just hop on the train
00:57:36.889 --> 00:57:41.090
for 30 euro and go to Bern and watch a World
00:57:41.090 --> 00:57:43.230
Cup. We're like, oh, great. You can watch a World
00:57:43.230 --> 00:57:46.849
Cup or you can watch. Nobody goes to watch US
00:57:46.849 --> 00:57:49.849
Nationals or the team trials. If you're not connected
00:57:49.849 --> 00:57:53.690
in the community proper or local, it's just not
00:57:53.690 --> 00:57:55.949
a draw. You're not winning anything, right? They're
00:57:55.949 --> 00:57:58.329
winning team spots, not winning money. You don't
00:57:58.329 --> 00:58:00.449
get to turn the lights off and like have music
00:58:00.449 --> 00:58:03.070
raging. That's not how sanctioned competitions
00:58:03.070 --> 00:58:08.409
work. Non -sanctioned competitions, you can play
00:58:08.409 --> 00:58:11.730
with what's allowed and not allowed in competition,
00:58:11.929 --> 00:58:13.969
and you can make it enjoyable for the athletes.
00:58:15.329 --> 00:58:19.170
At the DocMaster, they have streamers go off
00:58:19.170 --> 00:58:22.170
when they announce the winner, coming down from
00:58:22.170 --> 00:58:25.190
the ceiling, and it's like popping champagne
00:58:25.190 --> 00:58:27.849
and spraying it all over the place. It looks
00:58:27.849 --> 00:58:32.170
fun. Exactly. That's the word. It's fun. And
00:58:32.170 --> 00:58:35.570
it's enough money that you get to keep doing
00:58:35.570 --> 00:58:42.929
it. So for me, things like that are so valuable.
00:58:42.989 --> 00:58:48.869
And I do want to promote festival -style non
00:58:48.869 --> 00:58:53.690
-sanctioned competition as an anchor, a pillar
00:58:53.690 --> 00:58:56.519
of... climbing in north america and in europe
00:58:56.519 --> 00:58:59.519
anywhere really um we just i think it's more
00:58:59.519 --> 00:59:02.780
valuable in north america because we are we lag
00:59:02.780 --> 00:59:05.719
behind what's going on in europe simply through
00:59:05.719 --> 00:59:09.219
geography you know that's the drawback is that
00:59:09.219 --> 00:59:10.940
you can travel around europe in the same amount
00:59:10.940 --> 00:59:13.880
of time it takes you to travel around texas right
00:59:13.880 --> 00:59:18.239
yeah yeah um so yeah i'm i will i will stand
00:59:18.239 --> 00:59:20.920
up and and put my hand forward for do what you
00:59:20.920 --> 00:59:23.679
can um and go and then you have to support that
00:59:23.679 --> 00:59:27.400
so i think i've heard i was talking to um a couple
00:59:27.400 --> 00:59:29.059
friends of mine just a couple weeks ago about
00:59:29.059 --> 00:59:31.579
punk rock masters and they're like that's not
00:59:31.579 --> 00:59:34.920
real it's like yeah it's real and like it can't
00:59:34.920 --> 00:59:36.780
be real like the names that they had sort of
00:59:36.780 --> 00:59:38.659
confirmed athletes as they go down the list like
00:59:38.659 --> 00:59:40.960
yeah that's what happens when you put up 50 grand
00:59:40.960 --> 00:59:43.039
and like yeah oh well no one's ever put up 50
00:59:43.039 --> 00:59:45.440
grand how is that possible i was like a year's
00:59:45.440 --> 00:59:49.659
worth of legwork to get sponsors to be able to
00:59:49.659 --> 00:59:52.239
do that. That's how that happens. Yeah. Is that
00:59:52.239 --> 00:59:54.619
how they managed to afford such a big cash purse?
00:59:54.739 --> 00:59:57.119
Like just sponsors and - A lot of work. Yeah.
00:59:57.300 --> 00:59:59.760
Sponsors, connections, all of those things. And,
00:59:59.760 --> 01:00:02.820
you know, I think anybody who's tried, and I
01:00:02.820 --> 01:00:04.320
know there'll be people that listen to your podcast
01:00:04.320 --> 01:00:07.250
that have tried. to either run or volunteer or
01:00:07.250 --> 01:00:09.010
work at their local gym or have been part of
01:00:09.010 --> 01:00:11.710
competition climbing and they've tried to fundraise
01:00:11.710 --> 01:00:14.409
or find sponsors or find like literally anything
01:00:14.409 --> 01:00:16.969
like for a youth comp or a local comp or just
01:00:16.969 --> 01:00:19.030
stuff to give their volunteers, they know how
01:00:19.030 --> 01:00:22.530
hard it is to cold call businesses and ask for
01:00:22.530 --> 01:00:26.090
stuff. There is a finite number of climbing companies
01:00:26.090 --> 01:00:29.849
and they cannot give out climbing stuff to every
01:00:29.849 --> 01:00:31.550
competition that asks them. And they're also
01:00:31.550 --> 01:00:33.869
not making a ton of money. So we keep going back
01:00:33.869 --> 01:00:36.440
to this pool. over and over and over again and
01:00:36.440 --> 01:00:40.659
be like hey um hi hi evolve can you give us some
01:00:40.659 --> 01:00:43.099
shoes i'm like this is like the 50th request
01:00:43.099 --> 01:00:45.820
we've had this year for shoes and no we can't
01:00:45.820 --> 01:00:48.579
so yeah we sent you some brushes and a couple
01:00:48.579 --> 01:00:50.139
of t -shirts that were misprinted how's that
01:00:50.139 --> 01:00:53.699
so then you have to start thinking well like
01:00:53.699 --> 01:00:56.280
what if i went to walmart and i asked the walmart
01:00:56.280 --> 01:00:58.699
guys if they would give me 50 gift cards for
01:00:58.699 --> 01:01:01.239
my local competition so fundraising is really
01:01:01.239 --> 01:01:04.440
hard and i think You have to go outside of the
01:01:04.440 --> 01:01:07.199
climbing box a little bit to really make it work.
01:01:07.699 --> 01:01:11.639
So you get, I mean, U .S. Nationals has been
01:01:11.639 --> 01:01:15.539
sponsored by Yeti. Yeah. Which isn't a climbing
01:01:15.539 --> 01:01:18.400
company. And now there's an insurance company
01:01:18.400 --> 01:01:20.639
that's on board, right, that sponsors the U .S.
01:01:20.659 --> 01:01:25.159
National Program. So if anybody that's watched
01:01:25.159 --> 01:01:27.320
any number of sports will see that most of the
01:01:27.320 --> 01:01:29.659
big sponsorships are not sports -related companies.
01:01:30.760 --> 01:01:34.420
There's no Nike Stadium in the NBA. Nike doesn't,
01:01:34.420 --> 01:01:37.320
didn't buy a stadium. MetLife is an insurance
01:01:37.320 --> 01:01:39.599
company. Like all of the real money in big sports
01:01:39.599 --> 01:01:43.440
comes from other places. Yeah, I guess that kind
01:01:43.440 --> 01:01:47.139
of leads into one of the other hot takes that
01:01:47.139 --> 01:01:49.159
you had. Well, what you had mentioned was that
01:01:49.159 --> 01:01:51.099
people aren't willing to pay for climbing entertainment.
01:01:51.639 --> 01:01:55.539
But I guess that also kind of extends into just
01:01:55.539 --> 01:01:59.300
like, like you said, sports brands not being.
01:01:59.960 --> 01:02:02.780
Like not being that profitable, I guess. Is that
01:02:02.780 --> 01:02:05.420
what it is? Yeah. And it's a fair question because
01:02:05.420 --> 01:02:07.099
I did bring it up when we were talking before.
01:02:08.000 --> 01:02:13.380
And it's something that I struggle with being
01:02:13.380 --> 01:02:21.980
inside climbing media. And I think that the sustainability
01:02:21.980 --> 01:02:28.420
of climbing media is like razor thin. Yeah. The
01:02:28.420 --> 01:02:31.239
number of people, and I've put polls on my Instagram,
01:02:31.500 --> 01:02:35.440
I've talked to, I mean, I've just talked to thousands
01:02:35.440 --> 01:02:39.800
of climbers over the years. And every time you
01:02:39.800 --> 01:02:43.659
say, would you pay for that? Most climbers say
01:02:43.659 --> 01:02:48.519
no. So climbers won't, and it starts at the bottom.
01:02:48.739 --> 01:02:50.639
Like, well, why would I pay to enter a comp when
01:02:50.639 --> 01:02:53.079
I can just climb those boulders on Monday for
01:02:53.079 --> 01:02:55.119
free? Like, I don't know, because it supports
01:02:55.119 --> 01:02:57.829
the climbing community. So why wouldn't you?
01:02:58.510 --> 01:03:04.030
I have a friend who's been in bobsled forever.
01:03:04.150 --> 01:03:05.409
So he's now the high performance director of
01:03:05.409 --> 01:03:07.710
Bobsled Canada. And we were talking about like
01:03:07.710 --> 01:03:09.989
fringe sports and like how you kind of get money
01:03:09.989 --> 01:03:12.070
and where the, where it goes and what happens.
01:03:12.150 --> 01:03:16.550
And he said, well, how much of your average person's
01:03:16.550 --> 01:03:19.010
gym membership goes to the federation? And I
01:03:19.010 --> 01:03:21.980
was like, what? He was like, how much of. Like
01:03:21.980 --> 01:03:23.719
if I go and buy a year's gym membership, how
01:03:23.719 --> 01:03:26.179
much of that is earmarked to go straight up to
01:03:26.179 --> 01:03:27.940
the National Federation? I was like, bro, zero.
01:03:28.780 --> 01:03:31.039
It's like, why not? It's like, how many people
01:03:31.039 --> 01:03:33.559
have national, have memberships at gyms? And
01:03:33.559 --> 01:03:37.559
if you just took 20 bucks a year, I said, because
01:03:37.559 --> 01:03:39.059
we've taught, and I've talked about it on a smaller
01:03:39.059 --> 01:03:40.300
level and people are like, well, why would I
01:03:40.300 --> 01:03:43.119
pay for something I don't do? And that's not
01:03:43.119 --> 01:03:45.099
just climbing, lots of sports. Like, why would
01:03:45.099 --> 01:03:46.940
I support something? I don't compete. Why would
01:03:46.940 --> 01:03:49.320
I want to pay for competition? But your national
01:03:49.320 --> 01:03:52.070
team is self -funded. They buy their own uniforms.
01:03:52.210 --> 01:03:54.510
They have to buy their own plane tickets to go
01:03:54.510 --> 01:03:57.610
to the youth world championships. So we have
01:03:57.610 --> 01:04:01.210
this problem where we need money, but we have
01:04:01.210 --> 01:04:04.750
people who are unwilling to spend money that's
01:04:04.750 --> 01:04:08.550
not to their own kind of benefit path. And then
01:04:08.550 --> 01:04:10.730
it grows. So I want to consume climbing media.
01:04:10.849 --> 01:04:15.329
I want to watch World Cups. Okay. So you'll have
01:04:15.329 --> 01:04:17.010
noticed, and I'm sure lots of people will notice,
01:04:17.130 --> 01:04:20.550
that... People say that World Cup climbing in
01:04:20.550 --> 01:04:25.889
Europe is now, in quotes, behind a paywall. It's
01:04:25.889 --> 01:04:31.070
not. It's on TV. That was always the goal. The
01:04:31.070 --> 01:04:34.489
goal was always be big enough to play with the
01:04:34.489 --> 01:04:37.710
big kids and be on television. And people are
01:04:37.710 --> 01:04:40.389
like, well, I don't want to pay for X, Y, Z.
01:04:40.530 --> 01:04:42.309
It's like, okay, well, I want to watch the NBA.
01:04:42.469 --> 01:04:45.909
I'm an NBA fan. I love the NBA. So I pay for
01:04:45.909 --> 01:04:48.690
cable with the channel. It allows me to watch
01:04:48.690 --> 01:04:52.210
the NBA. And so this mindset, even of saying,
01:04:52.250 --> 01:04:54.070
why would I pay for cable to watch climbing?
01:04:54.070 --> 01:04:56.690
It used to be free on YouTube. It's like, OK,
01:04:56.869 --> 01:05:00.949
but we've outgrown free on YouTube. So you want
01:05:00.949 --> 01:05:03.389
a better product. You've asked for a better product.
01:05:03.570 --> 01:05:05.469
You've asked for a better way to consume it.
01:05:05.550 --> 01:05:08.530
You've asked you like you take your laptop and
01:05:08.530 --> 01:05:11.090
project it onto your TV. Five years ago, it was
01:05:11.090 --> 01:05:15.150
pixelated to watch a World Cup. Now you can watch
01:05:15.150 --> 01:05:19.190
it on cable. On TV, by just sitting back on your
01:05:19.190 --> 01:05:21.630
couch and watching your 60 inch TV, high res,
01:05:21.889 --> 01:05:25.469
that was always the goal. But to say that you
01:05:25.469 --> 01:05:27.710
don't want to pay for cable, how can I steal
01:05:27.710 --> 01:05:31.329
this and have that be the default rather than,
01:05:31.329 --> 01:05:34.130
oh yeah, like my dad watches Premiership Football
01:05:34.130 --> 01:05:36.789
and so he just pays for DAZN because you can't
01:05:36.789 --> 01:05:39.889
watch Premiership Football in Canada unless you
01:05:39.889 --> 01:05:43.289
pay for an extra cable channel. If you want to
01:05:43.289 --> 01:05:46.210
watch F1, so all these people that consume sports.
01:05:47.460 --> 01:05:51.159
understand that part of consumption is economics.
01:05:51.920 --> 01:05:55.920
And I think climbing for so long has had this,
01:05:55.920 --> 01:06:01.480
it's owed to me that it's free, that I struggle
01:06:01.480 --> 01:06:03.619
with it. And I struggle with people saying, I
01:06:03.619 --> 01:06:06.119
wouldn't pay $5 to watch that. It's not good
01:06:06.119 --> 01:06:09.820
enough. Okay. So the conversation we had earlier,
01:06:09.900 --> 01:06:11.579
how much does it cost to put on a live stream?
01:06:12.579 --> 01:06:15.360
If you want the... quality to go up if you want
01:06:15.360 --> 01:06:18.000
the cameras to be better higher resolution you
01:06:18.000 --> 01:06:19.880
want the graphics to be better you want to have
01:06:19.880 --> 01:06:22.679
a producer who can actually talk to me rather
01:06:22.679 --> 01:06:24.619
than just passing post -it notes back and forth
01:06:24.619 --> 01:06:29.019
at 100 miles an hour yeah then that costs money
01:06:29.019 --> 01:06:31.159
oh I don't want to have commercials though I
01:06:31.159 --> 01:06:33.059
don't want to stop for a commercial like okay
01:06:33.059 --> 01:06:35.760
so now what like where does the money where is
01:06:35.760 --> 01:06:37.119
it supposed to come from you don't want to pay
01:06:37.119 --> 01:06:40.980
to watch it you don't want advertisers to pay
01:06:40.980 --> 01:06:44.889
so that you can watch it Oh, why don't we just
01:06:44.889 --> 01:06:47.210
put like someone's logo in a corner of a screen?
01:06:47.369 --> 01:06:50.110
Okay. So find me, find me a company that's going
01:06:50.110 --> 01:06:52.989
to give me 20 grand to ghost their logo in the
01:06:52.989 --> 01:06:56.269
screen, but not show a commercial. So I think
01:06:56.269 --> 01:07:01.409
there's so many places where it wouldn't be that
01:07:01.409 --> 01:07:04.789
difficult to contribute to climbing media, to
01:07:04.789 --> 01:07:08.929
consume competition climbing. But for some reason
01:07:08.929 --> 01:07:11.889
we haven't pushed the norm to, of course you
01:07:11.889 --> 01:07:14.699
pay for that. Of course I do. Oh, I don't want
01:07:14.699 --> 01:07:16.320
to watch, I wouldn't pay to watch Canadian nationals.
01:07:16.360 --> 01:07:19.579
Okay. So I don't want to tell you how many times
01:07:19.579 --> 01:07:23.900
I've, I've gone to competitions to put on a broadcast
01:07:23.900 --> 01:07:29.139
for $0 and spent my own money on my own points
01:07:29.139 --> 01:07:33.079
to travel, buy my own food, because I think that
01:07:33.079 --> 01:07:36.719
competition and being able to showcase it has
01:07:36.719 --> 01:07:41.980
that value. I am super passionate about it. And
01:07:41.980 --> 01:07:44.760
I think it's funny that it comes off as a hot
01:07:44.760 --> 01:07:46.539
take. And for me, it shouldn't be. That should
01:07:46.539 --> 01:07:48.780
just be like, oh, yeah, that man is just speaking
01:07:48.780 --> 01:07:51.059
facts about what do you mean people don't want
01:07:51.059 --> 01:07:53.059
to pay? Like, I tell other people that don't
01:07:53.059 --> 01:07:55.119
watch climbing that people don't want to pay
01:07:55.119 --> 01:07:57.179
to watch climbing. And they're like, well, how
01:07:57.179 --> 01:08:00.179
do they expect it to get to them? Like, where
01:08:00.179 --> 01:08:02.880
is the money supposed to come from? Oh, the IFSC
01:08:02.880 --> 01:08:04.780
has millions of dollars in its bank account.
01:08:04.920 --> 01:08:09.980
Like, they don't. They definitely don't. So,
01:08:09.980 --> 01:08:12.059
and then when you bring it back down a level
01:08:12.059 --> 01:08:13.599
and down a level and down a level in the national
01:08:13.599 --> 01:08:17.020
championships, I mean, if you want people to
01:08:17.020 --> 01:08:19.979
watch, then yes, the quality has to be at a certain
01:08:19.979 --> 01:08:21.880
level where people are willing to pay to watch,
01:08:22.020 --> 01:08:25.079
but we're there now, right? We're streaming on
01:08:25.079 --> 01:08:28.800
YouTube in, you know, 20, like full resolution
01:08:28.800 --> 01:08:33.220
to say, would you pay 25 bucks to watch, you
01:08:33.220 --> 01:08:38.739
know, all of the NACS comps? It's not a lot of
01:08:38.739 --> 01:08:42.760
money. Would you pay 20 bucks to watch the national
01:08:42.760 --> 01:08:44.939
championships, which is like seven days of competing?
01:08:46.340 --> 01:08:49.300
To me, that shouldn't be a lot of money. The
01:08:49.300 --> 01:08:51.260
U .S. did a really good job a couple of years
01:08:51.260 --> 01:08:56.279
ago introducing commercials, essentially between
01:08:56.279 --> 01:09:00.159
each boulder. So after everyone's finished boulder
01:09:00.159 --> 01:09:03.140
one, there's a natural break. And the athletes
01:09:03.140 --> 01:09:05.560
don't care if they have to sit for 45 more seconds.
01:09:06.909 --> 01:09:11.350
They flipped the script and said, in sanctioned
01:09:11.350 --> 01:09:14.949
competition, in order to make the product consumable,
01:09:15.170 --> 01:09:19.949
then the show needs to pull more strings than
01:09:19.949 --> 01:09:26.529
the competition does. So the producer is at ISO
01:09:26.529 --> 01:09:29.130
telling the climber when they can go out on the
01:09:29.130 --> 01:09:32.609
mat, not a judge. Because the climbers come off
01:09:32.609 --> 01:09:35.829
the boulder and they have them stand. Like this,
01:09:35.869 --> 01:09:38.130
facing out where there's a camera and we show
01:09:38.130 --> 01:09:40.649
that climber and their sort of immediate emotion
01:09:40.649 --> 01:09:43.569
after the boulder they just tried. And then their
01:09:43.569 --> 01:09:46.489
current score after that boulder. And then you
01:09:46.489 --> 01:09:50.210
wave them off and they run back. And then the
01:09:50.210 --> 01:09:51.970
next two come out, which gives the production
01:09:51.970 --> 01:09:54.210
team enough time to pull their name up, pull
01:09:54.210 --> 01:09:56.189
up their ranking and get them on their boulders.
01:09:57.170 --> 01:10:01.270
So now the competition waits for the broadcast.
01:10:02.440 --> 01:10:04.819
which is every other sport. Anyone who's watched
01:10:04.819 --> 01:10:08.779
any sport live understands TV timeouts. So it
01:10:08.779 --> 01:10:11.260
happens X number of times. And climbing, we said,
01:10:11.340 --> 01:10:13.640
what if we just did it three times after boulder
01:10:13.640 --> 01:10:15.800
one, after boulder two, after boulder three?
01:10:16.699 --> 01:10:18.840
And some people think it's fine. And some people
01:10:18.840 --> 01:10:20.199
are like, I can't believe they're putting commercials
01:10:20.199 --> 01:10:22.939
in climbing. So, I mean, I think we could probably
01:10:22.939 --> 01:10:26.960
talk for two hours only about this topic. And
01:10:26.960 --> 01:10:30.039
I don't, I'm not here to shame people who...
01:10:30.650 --> 01:10:32.829
can't afford to spend money on climbing media
01:10:32.829 --> 01:10:35.069
who are very careful with what they do or how
01:10:35.069 --> 01:10:37.090
they live their life. It's not about that. It's
01:10:37.090 --> 01:10:41.310
about this imbalance of saying, why isn't it
01:10:41.310 --> 01:10:43.109
more accessible? Why can't I watch it in higher
01:10:43.109 --> 01:10:45.729
quality? And then in the same breath say, no,
01:10:45.770 --> 01:10:48.369
I don't want to pay for it. So I do struggle
01:10:48.369 --> 01:10:50.010
with that. I have trouble with it. I don't think
01:10:50.010 --> 01:10:52.270
that cable is a paywall just because it used
01:10:52.270 --> 01:10:55.170
to be free. And if you had told a bunch of climbers
01:10:55.170 --> 01:10:59.289
in 1995 that competition climbing would be on
01:10:59.289 --> 01:11:02.750
cable tv regularly in a world cup season they
01:11:02.750 --> 01:11:06.949
would be like oh my god we're rock stars rock
01:11:06.949 --> 01:11:09.189
stars so the snowbird world cup one of the first
01:11:09.189 --> 01:11:12.229
competitions the snowbird competition outdoors
01:11:12.229 --> 01:11:17.569
on on the side of a building is on cbs so we
01:11:17.569 --> 01:11:21.130
started there and then we regressed into people
01:11:21.130 --> 01:11:23.710
dirtbag climbers saying oh i want to spend my
01:11:23.710 --> 01:11:26.510
money on a new pair of shoes Okay. I think that's
01:11:26.510 --> 01:11:29.609
like the most convincing argument for maybe like
01:11:29.609 --> 01:11:33.529
why Eurosport and Discovery Plus or whatever
01:11:33.529 --> 01:11:38.310
is normal and actually expected. Let's see, taking
01:11:38.310 --> 01:11:41.069
a look at time. I think we can move into some
01:11:41.069 --> 01:11:43.270
of the Discord and Instagram questions now. So
01:11:43.270 --> 01:11:45.970
first one from Omar H5, is the current setting
01:11:45.970 --> 01:11:48.010
of dynamic moves a good way to make climbing
01:11:48.010 --> 01:11:50.550
more mainstream? A root setting question. Hey,
01:11:50.710 --> 01:11:59.739
I... I think that creativity, variety, ingenuity
01:11:59.739 --> 01:12:04.039
are super, super important. So anybody that's
01:12:04.039 --> 01:12:07.739
trying to do something new or a version of something
01:12:07.739 --> 01:12:10.920
that creates exciting movement, I think is valuable.
01:12:11.079 --> 01:12:15.479
So dynamic movement has become a way to make
01:12:15.479 --> 01:12:19.520
very good athletes make mistakes. So it's a very
01:12:19.520 --> 01:12:23.079
good way to separate competition. So a paddle
01:12:23.079 --> 01:12:25.000
dyno, you're probably not going to flash it.
01:12:25.199 --> 01:12:28.300
Boom. I immediately don't have a tie. I'm winning,
01:12:28.380 --> 01:12:31.939
right? Great. No ties. Perfect. Um, some people
01:12:31.939 --> 01:12:33.960
won't get a paddle dyno. Some people won't get
01:12:33.960 --> 01:12:36.260
like, you know, something where you have to twist
01:12:36.260 --> 01:12:39.079
or push or, you know, bend or like land or coordinate.
01:12:39.960 --> 01:12:42.859
So I think it's important in that way is that
01:12:42.859 --> 01:12:46.020
it is a, it's an element of movement that we
01:12:46.020 --> 01:12:49.220
have always done indoors. We've had dyno comps
01:12:49.220 --> 01:12:53.720
since. I mean, we had dino competitions at World
01:12:53.720 --> 01:12:56.279
Cups as like a whole separate, there was a world
01:12:56.279 --> 01:13:01.739
record, right? They had basically a ruler with
01:13:01.739 --> 01:13:04.500
a slot and you could move, they would move the
01:13:04.500 --> 01:13:07.720
holdout on like ruler demarcations. And it was
01:13:07.720 --> 01:13:11.319
a diagonal, I think maybe 30 degrees. And it
01:13:11.319 --> 01:13:13.319
would move it out until you had a winner. And
01:13:13.319 --> 01:13:15.340
then they would try and be how far can you make
01:13:15.340 --> 01:13:18.479
a single dino and stick it. At World Cups? Yeah.
01:13:18.859 --> 01:13:24.329
Oh. You had no idea. Early 2000s. My friend,
01:13:24.369 --> 01:13:27.430
Darhan Alshambo, has been climbing, competing
01:13:27.430 --> 01:13:31.130
in Canada now as a gym owner in Edmonton. Won
01:13:31.130 --> 01:13:35.470
one of those. Was a good climber, but was so
01:13:35.470 --> 01:13:40.310
springy. So dino comps have been a part of climbing
01:13:40.310 --> 01:13:43.270
for longer than people might think, especially
01:13:43.270 --> 01:13:44.670
if they've only been climbing for five or 10
01:13:44.670 --> 01:13:48.020
years. They're like, oh, this feels new. Time
01:13:48.020 --> 01:13:51.140
is a flat circle when it comes to inventing,
01:13:51.140 --> 01:13:53.779
right? I like to draw kind of an interesting,
01:13:54.000 --> 01:13:56.640
what I think is someone who's non -musical, but
01:13:56.640 --> 01:14:00.000
there's only so many notes. But can you find
01:14:00.000 --> 01:14:03.380
a different way to combine those notes in a way
01:14:03.380 --> 01:14:06.199
that makes people think that this is new? So
01:14:06.199 --> 01:14:09.039
then we get musical genres and we get things
01:14:09.039 --> 01:14:10.680
that are interesting or things that we might
01:14:10.680 --> 01:14:13.640
kind of be thrown off by, things that might,
01:14:13.739 --> 01:14:17.000
you know. be offensive to our ears but we understand
01:14:17.000 --> 01:14:19.180
that some other people might like it so i think
01:14:19.180 --> 01:14:22.439
that climbing movement there is we can only do
01:14:22.439 --> 01:14:24.319
so much like we've created a bunch of climbing
01:14:24.319 --> 01:14:27.699
holds we've we've created what we think is physical
01:14:27.699 --> 01:14:29.619
movement and then someone says well what if you
01:14:29.619 --> 01:14:31.500
could just jump further like i can jump further
01:14:31.500 --> 01:14:34.779
but there's a limit to how far you can jump right
01:14:34.779 --> 01:14:36.560
so if you look at like the high jump world record
01:14:36.560 --> 01:14:39.460
the long jump world record it grows by like incremental
01:14:39.460 --> 01:14:43.829
amounts every every other year or two years,
01:14:43.930 --> 01:14:46.810
three years. So you can't just make the moves
01:14:46.810 --> 01:14:49.689
bigger. You can't just make the move smaller,
01:14:49.949 --> 01:14:51.609
the hold smaller, because that's not realistic.
01:14:52.449 --> 01:14:54.649
You can only make them so slopey or so slippery.
01:14:54.729 --> 01:14:56.449
So now we've got no text problems or people are
01:14:56.449 --> 01:14:58.409
just like, are putting water on their hands and
01:14:58.409 --> 01:15:00.489
shoes. Like immediately the climber's adapted.
01:15:00.689 --> 01:15:02.369
Perfect. Love it. People licking their hands,
01:15:02.449 --> 01:15:04.800
right? Like, how do I grab this no text? So I
01:15:04.800 --> 01:15:07.460
think that big dynamic movement has always been
01:15:07.460 --> 01:15:09.420
a part of climbing because it's showy, it's exciting,
01:15:09.539 --> 01:15:11.840
it's fun. It's like how I can jump further than
01:15:11.840 --> 01:15:16.460
you is a very base level. I can run faster than
01:15:16.460 --> 01:15:18.880
you. I can jump farther than you. I can pick
01:15:18.880 --> 01:15:20.800
up a heavier thing than you can. These are like
01:15:20.800 --> 01:15:24.060
core elements to physical movement. And I think
01:15:24.060 --> 01:15:26.300
that I'm here for it. I mean, you make a creative
01:15:26.300 --> 01:15:28.859
way. The dino comp at the Jackalope, I was like,
01:15:28.899 --> 01:15:30.899
I'm only going to give out money to somebody
01:15:30.899 --> 01:15:34.170
that sticks a 360 dino. And that's like, people
01:15:34.170 --> 01:15:36.390
like never have never tried that before. Like,
01:15:36.409 --> 01:15:37.750
I don't even know, like, what would that even
01:15:37.750 --> 01:15:40.229
look like? So I think it's fun to play with movement.
01:15:40.529 --> 01:15:43.789
And I think that there are elements in which
01:15:43.789 --> 01:15:47.329
if you are new to route setting that you should
01:15:47.329 --> 01:15:50.310
be careful for safety and like, don't set a big
01:15:50.310 --> 01:15:52.729
Donald over her, like a protruding volume perhaps,
01:15:52.890 --> 01:15:55.750
but be creative, right? Oh, the only way you're
01:15:55.750 --> 01:15:57.069
going to stick this is if you land your foot
01:15:57.069 --> 01:15:59.489
at the same time, or you get two hands out. So,
01:15:59.489 --> 01:16:02.880
you know, the. The version of sort of the paddle
01:16:02.880 --> 01:16:05.539
dyno is not that different from the version of
01:16:05.539 --> 01:16:08.479
like kind of a like a little big dynamic movement,
01:16:08.539 --> 01:16:10.319
little half match to a pinch that you wouldn't
01:16:10.319 --> 01:16:12.100
be able to hold if you didn't flip this one over.
01:16:12.279 --> 01:16:17.560
And I did that in 2003. So, yeah, I'm here for
01:16:17.560 --> 01:16:20.800
it. I think it's a great way to make people think
01:16:20.800 --> 01:16:23.399
about how to move their bodies, how to initiate
01:16:23.399 --> 01:16:28.420
power, how to control power. That's part of dynamic
01:16:28.420 --> 01:16:31.899
climbing. I think it's a core pillar of climbing
01:16:31.899 --> 01:16:35.960
movement. Makes sense. Next one from Coach Susan
01:16:35.960 --> 01:16:38.100
McGuire. I think this one was pretty interesting.
01:16:38.640 --> 01:16:40.939
Many years from now, what do you want to be remembered
01:16:40.939 --> 01:16:43.439
for since you've done so much in the climbing
01:16:43.439 --> 01:16:48.699
space? Man, that is an existential question.
01:16:49.600 --> 01:16:56.560
I think I would. like to be remembered for having
01:16:56.560 --> 01:17:04.159
grown helped to grow knowledge interest and visibility
01:17:04.159 --> 01:17:07.619
of the sport i think i would like to be have
01:17:07.619 --> 01:17:10.640
looked back and for myself as well and said i
01:17:10.640 --> 01:17:14.319
did what i could to keep climbing moving in the
01:17:14.319 --> 01:17:20.380
direction that will make it successful so it's
01:17:20.380 --> 01:17:22.319
it's a tricky question um i don't want to be
01:17:22.319 --> 01:17:25.720
famous right That's not what broadcasters do.
01:17:26.579 --> 01:17:31.060
But they get to have those moments where the
01:17:31.060 --> 01:17:33.260
timing of everything was right and you get to
01:17:33.260 --> 01:17:35.279
be a part of something and then take that and
01:17:35.279 --> 01:17:38.100
build on it and see an idea and say, hey, hey,
01:17:38.119 --> 01:17:40.180
remember when that worked? What if we tried that?
01:17:40.260 --> 01:17:43.680
And if that became the norm, I would love to
01:17:43.680 --> 01:17:46.939
be part of the movement that makes climbing media
01:17:46.939 --> 01:17:51.619
grow into a place where it's just kind of. almost
01:17:51.619 --> 01:17:53.479
taken for granted. Like, of course I could watch
01:17:53.479 --> 01:17:56.500
that on TV, right? Bam. The foundation has been
01:17:56.500 --> 01:18:00.579
laid. That's good to know. Okay. Next one from
01:18:00.579 --> 01:18:04.039
Sue Lamb888. What is your current relationship
01:18:04.039 --> 01:18:09.140
with CEC? So climbing Escalade Canada? That's
01:18:09.140 --> 01:18:11.199
good. Your French is excellent. Oh, thank you.
01:18:11.460 --> 01:18:17.319
Very good. Very good. I do not have a role with
01:18:17.319 --> 01:18:23.500
the CEC. So I am essentially a contractor for
01:18:23.500 --> 01:18:28.600
doing events. So we have toyed with different
01:18:28.600 --> 01:18:34.380
models of having a succession plan because I
01:18:34.380 --> 01:18:36.399
think that we should grow the base. It's such
01:18:36.399 --> 01:18:44.300
a funny thing to say. I should not be thinking
01:18:44.300 --> 01:18:47.020
I need to go to an event because no one else
01:18:47.020 --> 01:18:50.069
will do it. So I think we need to grow some talent
01:18:50.069 --> 01:18:53.329
in the space where other people feel comfortable
01:18:53.329 --> 01:18:56.569
taking on a broadcast. So we talked about sort
01:18:56.569 --> 01:18:59.109
of a succession plan, like a training ground
01:18:59.109 --> 01:19:02.130
almost of having different co -commentators come
01:19:02.130 --> 01:19:05.170
in for different events. And so they have an
01:19:05.170 --> 01:19:07.310
opportunity to be exposed to commentary and see
01:19:07.310 --> 01:19:10.369
what that looks like and do they like it. I think
01:19:10.369 --> 01:19:15.449
I'm always surprised by people that say, Um,
01:19:15.630 --> 01:19:18.949
no, they never want to try commentary. Um, because
01:19:18.949 --> 01:19:21.529
some people are pretty cavalier about being,
01:19:21.609 --> 01:19:23.050
you know, how hard could it be? And how could
01:19:23.050 --> 01:19:24.289
this, I'm like, would you want to try it? Like,
01:19:24.329 --> 01:19:26.569
Oh Lord, no, I don't want to try it. Um, I just
01:19:26.569 --> 01:19:29.109
want to have an opinion on it. Um, and people
01:19:29.109 --> 01:19:31.569
who've done it once and they say, ah, man, that's
01:19:31.569 --> 01:19:34.029
not for me. Like, because it is a lot of work
01:19:34.029 --> 01:19:36.090
and I won't, we won't get into necessarily, you
01:19:36.090 --> 01:19:38.930
know, all that side of it, but it's a huge amount
01:19:38.930 --> 01:19:40.750
of work and it's a big mental drain to do an
01:19:40.750 --> 01:19:42.390
event. And I'm like, you're always exhausted
01:19:42.390 --> 01:19:45.680
after doing a broadcast. And I. But I think that
01:19:45.680 --> 01:19:49.680
having a model where we grow is important. And
01:19:49.680 --> 01:19:51.520
I would like to get back to that maybe with the
01:19:51.520 --> 01:19:56.220
CEC and say, I would be happy to do mock competitions.
01:19:56.319 --> 01:19:58.880
So the first time I work with a new co -commentator,
01:19:58.960 --> 01:20:01.720
sometimes I'll say, go watch a competition with
01:20:01.720 --> 01:20:04.260
the sound off and record yourself. What would
01:20:04.260 --> 01:20:07.039
you say in that moment? Or I'll go and I've been
01:20:07.039 --> 01:20:08.659
on a comp. So I've done this with someone before.
01:20:08.739 --> 01:20:10.180
Canadian Nationals was their first time they'd
01:20:10.180 --> 01:20:13.180
ever done a broadcast. We just pulled up a World
01:20:13.180 --> 01:20:15.659
Cup that they hadn't watched. And I just think
01:20:15.659 --> 01:20:17.319
I picked one I hadn't watched. And we turned
01:20:17.319 --> 01:20:19.539
the sound off and we just we're like on other
01:20:19.539 --> 01:20:21.739
sides of the country from each other. And we
01:20:21.739 --> 01:20:23.659
just commentated and then we debriefed on it.
01:20:23.880 --> 01:20:25.859
And they're like, oh, my God, I froze here. And
01:20:25.859 --> 01:20:27.659
I said that I talked over you and then I threw
01:20:27.659 --> 01:20:30.079
it to you and you get people on broadcast and
01:20:30.079 --> 01:20:35.779
they just go. Yeah. Like I like teed you up to
01:20:35.779 --> 01:20:38.229
have an opinion and they're like. they just their
01:20:38.229 --> 01:20:41.369
brain goes into some sideways mode so i think
01:20:41.369 --> 01:20:43.949
that having we have a root center development
01:20:43.949 --> 01:20:45.649
program we have a coaching development program
01:20:45.649 --> 01:20:48.109
we have long -term athlete development i think
01:20:48.109 --> 01:20:51.409
that there's still room to have let's make sure
01:20:51.409 --> 01:20:55.189
that we have people available to broadcast a
01:20:55.189 --> 01:20:57.710
comp because if there's a world cup if i'm i
01:20:57.710 --> 01:20:59.569
get back into doing world cups which is a whole
01:20:59.569 --> 01:21:02.550
kind of other side thing but if i get back into
01:21:02.550 --> 01:21:04.270
doing world cups or the olympics since there
01:21:04.270 --> 01:21:07.279
is some competing event in Canada that we should
01:21:07.279 --> 01:21:09.539
be broadcasting, then it shouldn't be, well,
01:21:09.579 --> 01:21:11.279
I guess we won't broadcast it because we don't
01:21:11.279 --> 01:21:12.920
have anyone who's experienced enough to do it.
01:21:13.020 --> 01:21:16.300
So I think there's room to grow experience at
01:21:16.300 --> 01:21:18.420
that federation level, but I don't carry a role
01:21:18.420 --> 01:21:21.659
with them at all. That practice, like practice
01:21:21.659 --> 01:21:24.239
commentating World Cup is a good idea. I feel
01:21:24.239 --> 01:21:26.260
like that would have been helpful. I'm one of
01:21:26.260 --> 01:21:28.380
those people who like, I did it once and I was
01:21:28.380 --> 01:21:31.060
like, Ooh, this is not, this is not good for
01:21:31.060 --> 01:21:35.640
me. Yeah. And you can practice something and
01:21:35.640 --> 01:21:37.079
realize that you can practice and be good at
01:21:37.079 --> 01:21:38.680
it. And you might practice something and go,
01:21:38.779 --> 01:21:43.079
wow, that's just, it doesn't align with how I
01:21:43.079 --> 01:21:45.500
process information or how I like to speak or
01:21:45.500 --> 01:21:49.960
whatever it is. It's obviously, it's not easy.
01:21:52.220 --> 01:21:53.939
I'm not here to say it's the hardest job in the
01:21:53.939 --> 01:21:58.199
world. I'm not trying to play that card. It's
01:21:58.199 --> 01:22:00.199
like, oh, you couldn't possibly do broadcast
01:22:00.199 --> 01:22:02.859
commentary. But it is challenging and it is something
01:22:02.859 --> 01:22:05.640
you have to work quite hard at in order to deliver
01:22:05.640 --> 01:22:08.159
the product that you think is appropriate for
01:22:08.159 --> 01:22:10.260
the audience. Yeah, just like climbing. It's
01:22:10.260 --> 01:22:13.600
crazy how much the pressure makes a huge difference.
01:22:13.779 --> 01:22:17.859
Even people who are wildly chatty just before
01:22:17.859 --> 01:22:23.840
a broadcast starts and then just go. They just
01:22:23.840 --> 01:22:26.039
suddenly. don't know what to say or don't think
01:22:26.039 --> 01:22:27.800
they had something to say and the pressure really
01:22:27.800 --> 01:22:31.500
does go to go what's going to happen and um for
01:22:31.500 --> 01:22:36.439
whatever reason um the way my brain is wired
01:22:36.439 --> 01:22:41.199
that focuses the pressure of i sat down in the
01:22:41.199 --> 01:22:43.600
chair for the first world cup you know went through
01:22:43.600 --> 01:22:44.939
the whole thing i had the list all the thing
01:22:44.939 --> 01:22:46.680
headsets on the screen of the black and the african
01:22:46.680 --> 01:22:51.359
junior like five four i was like here we go like
01:22:51.359 --> 01:22:53.439
you know obviously i had some butterflies i was
01:22:53.439 --> 01:22:57.149
nervous But I wasn't nervous and, you know, shut
01:22:57.149 --> 01:22:59.670
down. Yeah. No, I think it's kind of like what
01:22:59.670 --> 01:23:02.930
you said earlier about you have to keep all these
01:23:02.930 --> 01:23:04.789
other things in mind in terms of like how people
01:23:04.789 --> 01:23:07.489
will react to what you're saying and like you're
01:23:07.489 --> 01:23:09.750
not allowed to curse and stuff like that. It
01:23:09.750 --> 01:23:12.409
all like adds up in your brain as like and then
01:23:12.409 --> 01:23:14.369
you just kind of freeze because you're like,
01:23:14.449 --> 01:23:16.069
I can't do this. I can't do this. I can't do
01:23:16.069 --> 01:23:18.829
this. And it is something that the way if we
01:23:18.829 --> 01:23:21.170
go back to practicing, it's something that you
01:23:21.170 --> 01:23:23.720
can practice because the. Like if you and I are
01:23:23.720 --> 01:23:26.420
doing a broadcast together, A, it helps if we
01:23:26.420 --> 01:23:29.579
know how each other speak. So then you know if
01:23:29.579 --> 01:23:32.180
I'm pausing because I want to keep talking or
01:23:32.180 --> 01:23:35.500
if I'm pausing to give you room to speak. And
01:23:35.500 --> 01:23:37.140
then we don't talk over each other. And then
01:23:37.140 --> 01:23:39.899
you kind of layer in this idea that while you're
01:23:39.899 --> 01:23:43.619
talking, I'm listening to you because I need
01:23:43.619 --> 01:23:45.680
to know what you're saying. And then, but I'm
01:23:45.680 --> 01:23:48.779
also watching the competition to decide what's
01:23:48.779 --> 01:23:51.439
happening next. And when you finish, I need to
01:23:51.439 --> 01:23:53.659
decide to take your idea and move on with it.
01:23:53.960 --> 01:23:57.579
Take your idea and end it. Let it sit on its
01:23:57.579 --> 01:24:01.359
own. Give it back to you to continue. Cut you
01:24:01.359 --> 01:24:04.060
off and go to the action. Take what you're saying
01:24:04.060 --> 01:24:07.640
and pull it into the action, et cetera, et cetera.
01:24:07.800 --> 01:24:10.279
Meanwhile, there might be a producer in your
01:24:10.279 --> 01:24:12.680
ear saying, hey, if Colin does this boulder in
01:24:12.680 --> 01:24:14.479
two more tries, he's going to win. And you're
01:24:14.479 --> 01:24:16.380
like, you can't say, uh -huh. And you can't like
01:24:16.380 --> 01:24:19.579
look. towards the sky you just have to pretend
01:24:19.579 --> 01:24:21.420
that there is no one talking in your ear while
01:24:21.420 --> 01:24:24.840
you're talking and listening and watching and
01:24:24.840 --> 01:24:27.739
doing all of these mental calculations so you
01:24:27.739 --> 01:24:31.500
can practice having a conversation with somebody
01:24:31.500 --> 01:24:36.119
with a purpose and kind of a background that
01:24:36.119 --> 01:24:38.420
you are basically talking to it's a conversation
01:24:38.420 --> 01:24:43.369
about climbing woven through a competition that
01:24:43.369 --> 01:24:45.310
has moments that need to be addressed. And then
01:24:45.310 --> 01:24:47.050
you have to remember someone's name and how to
01:24:47.050 --> 01:24:50.470
pronounce it. And whether or not this is like,
01:24:50.529 --> 01:24:52.369
you forget what boulder they're on. Like we're
01:24:52.369 --> 01:24:56.250
on boulder three? Question mark? Yeah. It's too
01:24:56.250 --> 01:24:58.390
much. We got to move on. It's too much. My brain
01:24:58.390 --> 01:25:01.529
is, it can't handle this. Okay, we'll do one
01:25:01.529 --> 01:25:05.949
last one from M. Durkee. And I don't really know
01:25:05.949 --> 01:25:07.850
the meaning of this, so you might have to give
01:25:07.850 --> 01:25:10.210
some context here. What's your golf handicap?
01:25:12.790 --> 01:25:16.869
Mark is a climber who has also turned to golf
01:25:16.869 --> 01:25:18.890
and I started golfing a few years ago. So it's
01:25:18.890 --> 01:25:21.630
people that we golf with. It's high. It's much
01:25:21.630 --> 01:25:23.510
higher than I would like it to be. Well, okay.
01:25:23.569 --> 01:25:25.810
What does that even mean? I don't golf. Never
01:25:25.810 --> 01:25:28.050
really watched golf. I know like the basics.
01:25:28.350 --> 01:25:33.149
So golf is all golf courses are par is 71 or
01:25:33.149 --> 01:25:38.350
72. So your handicap is your average number of
01:25:38.350 --> 01:25:43.109
strokes over par. So if you're new to golf, you're
01:25:43.109 --> 01:25:44.569
going to you're going to shoot in the hundreds.
01:25:44.670 --> 01:25:47.229
You're going to be over 100. So your your handicap
01:25:47.229 --> 01:25:53.329
is like 32, 33, 34. Like it's the number of like
01:25:53.329 --> 01:25:57.329
shots between par and what you scored on the
01:25:57.329 --> 01:25:59.630
golf course that round. Yeah. So my golf game
01:25:59.630 --> 01:26:01.069
is not where I would like it to be. Golf and
01:26:01.069 --> 01:26:02.829
climbing are like weirdly in opposition of each
01:26:02.829 --> 01:26:04.489
other because they both take quite a lot of time.
01:26:05.029 --> 01:26:07.689
Any like does anything transfer you feel like?
01:26:08.289 --> 01:26:11.229
I mean. In all seriousness, yeah, a few things.
01:26:12.970 --> 01:26:17.630
It's a very complex movement. The golf swing
01:26:17.630 --> 01:26:20.850
is one of the hardest things that anybody that's
01:26:20.850 --> 01:26:22.229
listening to this play golf is nodding right
01:26:22.229 --> 01:26:23.829
now. They're like, heck yeah, golf swing is one
01:26:23.829 --> 01:26:25.270
of the hardest things you could do. And when
01:26:25.270 --> 01:26:26.930
I started playing golf, I was like, the ball
01:26:26.930 --> 01:26:29.189
doesn't move. Are you kidding me? Like I play
01:26:29.189 --> 01:26:31.949
tennis, like I played squash, I played ping pong.
01:26:31.989 --> 01:26:33.430
I've done all these things where the ball is
01:26:33.430 --> 01:26:35.390
moving and you still have to hit it. So the ball
01:26:35.390 --> 01:26:37.109
is just sitting there all the time. How hard
01:26:37.109 --> 01:26:39.329
could it possibly be? It's really hard. A golf
01:26:39.329 --> 01:26:44.229
swing is super complex. And you have to turn
01:26:44.229 --> 01:26:47.010
it into instinctual learned movements. You have
01:26:47.010 --> 01:26:51.369
to have sort of wired parts of your brain that
01:26:51.369 --> 01:26:54.850
have a repertoire that just have a natural. You
01:26:54.850 --> 01:26:56.689
kind of fall into this shot means this, this
01:26:56.689 --> 01:26:58.350
means that, do this, do this, do this, do this.
01:26:58.489 --> 01:27:00.850
If you try to think about every piece of each
01:27:00.850 --> 01:27:04.229
muscle group, every time you climb, you would
01:27:04.229 --> 01:27:06.250
lose your mind and you'd stumble and trip. If
01:27:06.250 --> 01:27:07.529
you tried to think about everything it takes
01:27:07.529 --> 01:27:11.810
to walk or jump or go up or downstairs, you would
01:27:11.810 --> 01:27:14.649
lose your mind. So these are things that are
01:27:14.649 --> 01:27:17.289
so natural movement -based that we take them
01:27:17.289 --> 01:27:20.470
all for granted. So easy climbing, good climbers
01:27:20.470 --> 01:27:22.930
take for granted. New climbers take nothing for
01:27:22.930 --> 01:27:25.020
granted. New climbers are... are thinking all
01:27:25.020 --> 01:27:27.060
the time of what do you mean i need to move my
01:27:27.060 --> 01:27:29.300
like three of my limbs at the same time like
01:27:29.300 --> 01:27:32.119
i just want to go left left right right and this
01:27:32.119 --> 01:27:33.899
game is really hard and i'm pumped and i'm doing
01:27:33.899 --> 01:27:35.359
pull -ups you're like no no you want to chain
01:27:35.359 --> 01:27:39.960
them together right so you have to learn to not
01:27:39.960 --> 01:27:43.279
think about how to initiate a pull while at the
01:27:43.279 --> 01:27:45.279
same time twisting turning reaching letting go
01:27:45.279 --> 01:27:47.380
how long to pull for how much to pull how much
01:27:47.380 --> 01:27:50.420
to push etc etc and a golf swing you just have
01:27:50.420 --> 01:27:53.380
to stand over the ball and go just come through
01:27:53.380 --> 01:27:55.479
and do your natural swing motion so in terms
01:27:55.479 --> 01:27:58.220
of physical literacy in terms of like knowledge
01:27:58.220 --> 01:28:01.000
of movement um there's tons and tons and tons
01:28:01.000 --> 01:28:03.859
of parallels and it's wildly frustrating and
01:28:03.859 --> 01:28:05.619
anybody that's projected anything for more than
01:28:05.619 --> 01:28:08.039
a month and also frustrating is to just why can't
01:28:08.039 --> 01:28:11.340
i do this one thing um golf is wildly frustrating
01:28:11.340 --> 01:28:13.979
why can't i just do this one thing slightly better
01:28:13.979 --> 01:28:17.020
yeah the frustration um they're best friends
01:28:17.020 --> 01:28:20.300
no i get that and the golf stick is really long
01:28:20.300 --> 01:28:23.439
so it's just The margin of error is very small
01:28:23.439 --> 01:28:26.500
because it's just so far away from you. And it's
01:28:26.500 --> 01:28:28.520
this big. And if you get it too high or too low
01:28:28.520 --> 01:28:30.579
or too in or too out, you've missed. Like the
01:28:30.579 --> 01:28:33.859
sweet spot on the head of a golf club is like
01:28:33.859 --> 01:28:37.159
the size of a golf ball. Yeah. I mean, I missed
01:28:37.159 --> 01:28:40.300
the entire ball anyway. So I'm not at that point
01:28:40.300 --> 01:28:42.680
yet. You and most people who try for the first
01:28:42.680 --> 01:28:44.539
time. And if you walked into a climbing gym and
01:28:44.539 --> 01:28:45.659
I said, oh, the first thing you need to do is
01:28:45.659 --> 01:28:49.359
hit this dino, you would miss. You need to learn
01:28:49.359 --> 01:28:50.840
the movement pattern. You need to learn what's
01:28:50.840 --> 01:28:52.659
important. You need to learn how to anchor and
01:28:52.659 --> 01:28:55.279
how to have balance and kind of push -pull and
01:28:55.279 --> 01:28:58.720
all those sorts of things. There are interesting
01:28:58.720 --> 01:29:02.779
similarities when it comes to ability to move
01:29:02.779 --> 01:29:05.840
in a certain way. Okay, cool. Well, I think that
01:29:05.840 --> 01:29:09.000
is all the questions I had. Any last -minute
01:29:09.000 --> 01:29:11.260
words of wisdom or things you really got to get
01:29:11.260 --> 01:29:13.899
out there? Two things, if you'll allow me, the
01:29:13.899 --> 01:29:19.739
platform. The first one is be a fan. Be a fan
01:29:19.739 --> 01:29:23.140
of the sport that you participate in. Be willing
01:29:23.140 --> 01:29:27.979
to promote other people's success. Be willing
01:29:27.979 --> 01:29:31.880
to promote the sport's success as a whole. Be
01:29:31.880 --> 01:29:34.800
willing to give people grace who are also doing
01:29:34.800 --> 01:29:37.920
that. Be willing to give people grace to enjoy
01:29:37.920 --> 01:29:39.600
the sport at the level that they want to enjoy
01:29:39.600 --> 01:29:45.140
it at. I coach people who have... been climbing
01:29:45.140 --> 01:29:47.659
at v5 for a decade and never been happier and
01:29:47.659 --> 01:29:49.340
just want to learn to be a little bit more effective
01:29:49.340 --> 01:29:53.819
or do something different um and it's it's important
01:29:53.819 --> 01:29:57.899
that we continue to create a space even in competition
01:29:57.899 --> 01:30:01.220
that allows everyone to consume it and enjoy
01:30:01.220 --> 01:30:03.899
it at a level of understanding that they think
01:30:03.899 --> 01:30:07.840
is cool or fun and if they want to you know buy
01:30:08.909 --> 01:30:10.329
You know, we don't do this in climbing, right?
01:30:10.449 --> 01:30:11.710
You don't, I don't know how many people have
01:30:11.710 --> 01:30:13.489
a poster of their favorite climber up on their
01:30:13.489 --> 01:30:15.149
wall. But when I was skateboarding as a kid,
01:30:15.250 --> 01:30:18.029
I had Tony Hawk posters. Like I had posters everywhere.
01:30:18.329 --> 01:30:21.750
You know, I wore shirts. Like I consumed, I was
01:30:21.750 --> 01:30:24.210
a fan of the athletes that did the sport that
01:30:24.210 --> 01:30:26.789
I was trying to be good at. I read magazines
01:30:26.789 --> 01:30:29.050
that did all these things. And I think climbing.
01:30:29.850 --> 01:30:33.170
is dangerously close to i do it too so you know
01:30:33.170 --> 01:30:35.250
they're not like why would i be that infatuated
01:30:35.250 --> 01:30:36.829
with someone that's better than me at this thing
01:30:36.829 --> 01:30:39.270
or i don't compete so why would i watch climbing
01:30:39.270 --> 01:30:41.270
you might learn something about how you can move
01:30:41.270 --> 01:30:42.810
you might see something that will help you on
01:30:42.810 --> 01:30:45.850
your project outside so i think be a fan of the
01:30:45.850 --> 01:30:48.390
sport that you participate in um and just be
01:30:48.390 --> 01:30:52.729
open and be like accepting of the fact that lots
01:30:52.729 --> 01:30:54.489
of people like to do the sport in a different
01:30:54.489 --> 01:30:58.689
way and for some of us um competing is inherent
01:30:58.689 --> 01:31:02.109
in who we are and wanting to share that and wanting
01:31:02.109 --> 01:31:04.189
to create a platform where competition can grow
01:31:04.189 --> 01:31:07.590
and flourish is really, really important. And
01:31:07.590 --> 01:31:10.350
I think allow that to grow and maybe try it out.
01:31:10.390 --> 01:31:12.189
If you don't watch competitions, watch a competition
01:31:12.189 --> 01:31:14.289
and just say, man, that's pretty cool. That was
01:31:14.289 --> 01:31:16.369
wild. So I think that's the, that's something
01:31:16.369 --> 01:31:19.149
that I always want to tell people. And then the
01:31:19.149 --> 01:31:23.310
other thing is that if you, it's my, it's always
01:31:23.310 --> 01:31:25.250
my goal to try and provide knowledge. I like
01:31:25.250 --> 01:31:27.989
to just. transmit knowledge about climbing i'm
01:31:27.989 --> 01:31:30.310
a coach at heart and i take that mindset into
01:31:30.310 --> 01:31:34.289
broadcasting so if you watch a broadcast where
01:31:34.289 --> 01:31:37.390
someone is explaining something at a level that
01:31:37.390 --> 01:31:40.890
you already know appreciate that that commentator
01:31:40.890 --> 01:31:45.189
or that person or that color analyst is is trying
01:31:45.189 --> 01:31:49.449
to share knowledge so that someone might grow
01:31:49.449 --> 01:31:52.369
into the sport even more and find a way to appreciate
01:31:52.369 --> 01:31:56.420
it even more so there's this wonderful balance
01:31:56.420 --> 01:31:59.180
where we think, we don't really know how hard
01:31:59.180 --> 01:32:02.699
World Cup finals boulders are. They don't grade
01:32:02.699 --> 01:32:05.460
them. And they're not V14, right? That's just,
01:32:05.520 --> 01:32:07.960
you can't climb V14 in four minutes. So sometimes
01:32:07.960 --> 01:32:09.920
the boulders are not physically, they're not
01:32:09.920 --> 01:32:12.640
gradably that difficult. It's just all the other
01:32:12.640 --> 01:32:14.720
factors that smashed it together. So we kind
01:32:14.720 --> 01:32:15.939
of have this like, I don't know, how hard is
01:32:15.939 --> 01:32:17.960
it really? Like, could I do a World Cup semifinal
01:32:17.960 --> 01:32:22.560
boulder? Like, you could not. Step one. Being
01:32:22.560 --> 01:32:25.539
able to impart that knowledge for me is really
01:32:25.539 --> 01:32:27.220
important. And that comes down to being able
01:32:27.220 --> 01:32:30.060
to break down movement in a way that even if
01:32:30.060 --> 01:32:31.819
you've been climbing for a decade, maybe you
01:32:31.819 --> 01:32:34.539
didn't think about timing in that way. So I've
01:32:34.539 --> 01:32:37.020
coached people who've been climbing for 10 years
01:32:37.020 --> 01:32:40.079
who climb V8, V9, V10. And there's something
01:32:40.079 --> 01:32:43.000
to be learned at every level about how people
01:32:43.000 --> 01:32:46.979
move. So maybe watch with an open mind because
01:32:46.979 --> 01:32:50.609
the broadcaster is trying to give you some. deeper
01:32:50.609 --> 01:32:53.449
knowledge about movement why something's difficult
01:32:53.449 --> 01:32:57.310
why somebody that is a previous world cup you
01:32:57.310 --> 01:32:59.710
know gold medalist is falling off a boulder that
01:32:59.710 --> 01:33:03.289
looks like it should be very doable and don't
01:33:03.289 --> 01:33:05.050
just think that they're talking below you or
01:33:05.050 --> 01:33:06.270
they're talking to people who've never watched
01:33:06.270 --> 01:33:08.430
before i think there's something to learn and
01:33:08.430 --> 01:33:11.289
that's why we have coaches to to be able to learn
01:33:11.289 --> 01:33:15.300
and this is my platform to be able to help Get
01:33:15.300 --> 01:33:17.560
super high level climbing or national level climbing
01:33:17.560 --> 01:33:20.119
or festival level climbing and get that information
01:33:20.119 --> 01:33:22.619
over to you and kind of help you understand why
01:33:22.619 --> 01:33:25.180
it's exciting and why it's important. Great words
01:33:25.180 --> 01:33:28.439
of wisdom to end on. But actually, OK, also really
01:33:28.439 --> 01:33:32.880
quick. I just had a random thought. I wish climbing
01:33:32.880 --> 01:33:35.840
gyms showcased competition climbing a bit more
01:33:35.840 --> 01:33:40.460
in the gym. We can't spend too much time diving
01:33:40.460 --> 01:33:42.399
into this, but I just feel like that would help
01:33:42.399 --> 01:33:45.560
with the whole connecting with competition climbing
01:33:45.560 --> 01:33:48.520
or seeing a move on TV and being like, I could
01:33:48.520 --> 01:33:50.260
probably do that or it looks easier or something
01:33:50.260 --> 01:33:52.840
like that. Watch parties, right? Yeah. Our gym
01:33:52.840 --> 01:33:55.960
has a TV up behind the desk and when the World
01:33:55.960 --> 01:33:57.500
Cup's on, they'll just show replays that go on
01:33:57.500 --> 01:33:59.220
YouTube. It's funny every now and then I'm in
01:33:59.220 --> 01:34:01.520
the gym and I'm like, hey, that's me. And people
01:34:01.520 --> 01:34:03.760
are like, wait a minute, that's you? That guy
01:34:03.760 --> 01:34:06.569
climbs at my gym? Like, Oh, maybe, you know,
01:34:06.569 --> 01:34:08.329
so you get to have those moments. You're like,
01:34:08.390 --> 01:34:12.170
Oh, I've seen that person that I just saw at,
01:34:12.229 --> 01:34:14.109
you know, competing at us nationals. They climb
01:34:14.109 --> 01:34:18.289
in my gym or I watched, um, like a, a para world
01:34:18.289 --> 01:34:21.010
cup. And I'm like, Oh, you know, um, maybe I've
01:34:21.010 --> 01:34:23.630
seen adaptive climbers in my gym. Like, are we
01:34:23.630 --> 01:34:27.229
doing, you know, more to, to competitions? Awesome.
01:34:27.350 --> 01:34:29.109
Like, wait a minute. Like, this is totally like,
01:34:29.170 --> 01:34:30.869
I didn't know that that was that available. So
01:34:30.869 --> 01:34:33.779
yeah, watch parties. Especially if it's someone
01:34:33.779 --> 01:34:38.100
locally from you that's competing. And I love
01:34:38.100 --> 01:34:40.619
that idea. Or just have the TV up. So yeah, I
01:34:40.619 --> 01:34:42.399
think there's lots of things that gyms can do
01:34:42.399 --> 01:34:45.560
to make it exciting. Yeah, I can't believe it's
01:34:45.560 --> 01:34:47.720
just not more common now that I think about it.
01:34:48.039 --> 01:34:51.140
Absolutely. I'm with you. I fully support that
01:34:51.140 --> 01:34:53.199
idea. I think it's great. Well, on that note,
01:34:53.319 --> 01:34:56.899
I think we're a little bit over time. But thank
01:34:56.899 --> 01:34:59.640
you so much for joining me today. Anything you
01:34:59.640 --> 01:35:01.340
want to shout out or let people know where they
01:35:01.340 --> 01:35:04.539
can find you? Um, I'm on Instagram as MC Pete
01:35:04.539 --> 01:35:06.680
Woods and I try and post, um, you will see pictures
01:35:06.680 --> 01:35:08.819
of my cats. So that's also part of the deal.
01:35:08.880 --> 01:35:11.000
Um, but I, I try and post a lot of events that
01:35:11.000 --> 01:35:13.619
I'm at, um, and try and promote climbing. Um,
01:35:13.680 --> 01:35:16.779
so MC Pete was also my website. So if you're
01:35:16.779 --> 01:35:18.359
curious about other things that I've done, uh,
01:35:18.500 --> 01:35:21.060
you can go to mcpwoods .ca. Um, I've kind of
01:35:21.060 --> 01:35:23.060
got a little bit of background. Um, and if you
01:35:23.060 --> 01:35:25.539
want me to come coach in your city, I'm, I also
01:35:25.539 --> 01:35:27.699
coach, I teach some pretty interesting programs.
01:35:27.739 --> 01:35:29.619
So I'm happy to go. That's part of the things
01:35:29.619 --> 01:35:32.229
that I do to stay involved in climbing. And if
01:35:32.229 --> 01:35:34.989
you see an event that I'm promoting, just pass
01:35:34.989 --> 01:35:36.909
it around, you know, spread the word because
01:35:36.909 --> 01:35:41.130
the growth, being able to show media connection
01:35:41.130 --> 01:35:43.149
is super important. You know, even like the Pop
01:35:43.149 --> 01:35:44.829
Rock Masters, just go. If you're in California,
01:35:45.050 --> 01:35:47.609
go to Huntington Beach and watch it. You know,
01:35:47.609 --> 01:35:49.850
follow along on Instagram and be like, and get
01:35:49.850 --> 01:35:51.949
excited about the fact that these athletes are
01:35:51.949 --> 01:35:56.130
coming to California to clap. That's what competition
01:35:56.130 --> 01:35:58.229
should do for you. When it's coming near you,
01:35:58.310 --> 01:36:00.609
you should be like. Oh, I could go watch that.
01:36:00.850 --> 01:36:03.350
Oh, I'm too far away. I can watch it on, on a
01:36:03.350 --> 01:36:05.729
broadcast. Absolutely. I mean, awesome. Well,
01:36:05.770 --> 01:36:07.510
thank you again. And it was amazing to talk to
01:36:07.510 --> 01:36:09.449
you. It was great. Thanks for the really good
01:36:09.449 --> 01:36:11.189
questions. Good conversation. I had a blast.
01:36:11.289 --> 01:36:14.310
So I appreciate you, you know, putting a podcast
01:36:14.310 --> 01:36:16.989
like this together, which is, I mean, I love
01:36:16.989 --> 01:36:18.470
the name. The first time I saw it, I was just
01:36:18.470 --> 01:36:20.630
to finish off. I love the name because that's
01:36:20.630 --> 01:36:23.560
been this awesome real climbing. People back
01:36:23.560 --> 01:36:25.399
in the 80s were like, sport climbing is neither,
01:36:25.600 --> 01:36:27.460
right? It was tri -climbing or nothing. And bouldering
01:36:27.460 --> 01:36:29.340
is just playing. So we've always had these sort
01:36:29.340 --> 01:36:32.319
of expressions. And there are people that think
01:36:32.319 --> 01:36:34.220
that competition in plastic climbing is not real
01:36:34.220 --> 01:36:36.319
climbing. And it absolutely is. So I love that
01:36:36.319 --> 01:36:39.159
you've created this platform for people to come
01:36:39.159 --> 01:36:41.380
and share their passion. And there's so many
01:36:41.380 --> 01:36:43.079
places that it touches. And anybody that climbs
01:36:43.079 --> 01:36:47.760
in a gym consumes plastic. It's a blast. So I
01:36:47.760 --> 01:36:49.439
appreciate it. And I had a great time. Yeah,
01:36:49.460 --> 01:36:52.380
thank you. Thank you so much for making it to
01:36:52.380 --> 01:36:54.739
the end of the podcast. Don't forget to like
01:36:54.739 --> 01:36:56.899
and subscribe if you enjoyed. Otherwise, you
01:36:56.899 --> 01:37:00.000
are a super big climber. If you're listening
01:37:00.000 --> 01:37:02.560
on a podcasting platform, I'd appreciate if you
01:37:02.560 --> 01:37:05.520
rate it five stars and you can continue the discussion
01:37:05.520 --> 01:37:08.659
on the free competition climbing discord linked
01:37:08.659 --> 01:37:11.119
in the description. Thanks again for listening.
